Lakers Shenanigans Again

[savage1]

And 99-99 in Suns game and an 18-6 run by Suns. Which team is on the take and has the biggest egos? Suns cover game and 2nd 1/2. Fixed, fixed!

Your post is way off target and not even REMOTELY close to what I was saying or the circumstances for the two examples I mentioned.

[WayneChung]

uncle savvy-WHO LOVES YOU,WHO LOVES YOU BABE-YOUR BOY CHUNGIE DOES!!

[winner]

I've read your post CAREFULLY, and see the paranoia in them. Then I guess the last question of the evening is, who is more psychotic, the people fixing the games or the fools betting on them? I guess you haven't placed a bet in your 54 years of watching eh? B/c that would be foolish considering it's not on the up and up, correct? Enough of this mind-numbing "observations". I anxiously await tomm's services report and how they are crooked and lying (as if no one knew). Maybe they are the ones feeding the egos of the corrupt players. Hmmm.

[savage1]

uncle savvy-WHO LOVES YOU,WHO LOVES YOU BABE-YOUR BOY CHUNGIE DOES!!

Chung-guys like you and I have been around and seen it all.
I have the sense that like me, you have seen crap go over the years(not every day by any means)in NBA and NFL which has raised your eyebrows;sometimes 2=2 does equal if you get my drift.

[mmw151]

great post winner

[savage1]

I've read your post CAREFULLY, and see the paranoia in them. Then I guess the last question of the evening is, who is more psychotic, the people fixing the games or the fools betting on them? I guess you haven't placed a bet in your 54 years of watching eh? B/c that would be foolish considering it's not on the up and up, correct? Enough of this mind-numbing "observations". I anxiously await tomm's services report and how they are crooked and lying (as if no one knew). Maybe they are the ones feeding the egos of the corrupt players. Hmmm.

Winner-there is a fine line between paranoia and reality or for that matter between blind trust and stupidity-enough said.
Of course I bet and have bet for the last 30+ years or so;just because I bet does not mean I can't express an opinion based on what I see sometimes as interesting circumstances.
I pay taxes too but have no problem expressing my thoughts about the government and the mess we are in right now.
Speaking of services, I refer you to someone like Coverboy,who believes as I do, that many are corrupt, receive kickbacks from sportsbooks for referring players to them and especially when they lose with the plays which are given to them by the services;that is a separate issue though.
On second thought, maybe it isn't so different afterall.

[savage1]

Chung-guys like you and I have been around and seen it all.
I have the sense that like me, you have seen crap go over the years(not every day by any means)in NBA and NFL which has raised your eyebrows;sometimes 2=2 does equal if you get my drift.

Should read 2+2=4 or is it 5?

[savage1]

Good night amnd thanks to everyone who contributed to this. It has been fun so far.
TO BE CONTINUED.

[winner]

[QUOTE=savage1.
Of course I bet and have bet for the last 30+ years or so;just because I bet does not mean I can't express an opinion based on what I see sometimes as interesting circumstances.


Speaking of services, I refer you to someone like Coverboy,who believes as I do, that many are corrupt, receive kickbacks from sportsbooks for referring players to them and especially when they lose with the plays which are given to them by the services;that is a separate issue though.
On second thought, maybe it isn't so different afterall.[/QUOTE]


I didn't say anything about expressing your opinion, I said something about the foolishness for someone to bet on what they truly believe to be a fixed game. Would you play cards at a table where you thought they were marked, or throw dice at a table that you thought had loaded dice?

Do I believe services are corrupt? Yes, I think many if not most are. They are more concerned about marketing and new clients and not winning. Do I think they get a kickback for referrals. Probably. Similiar to the arrangement here at this site I would assume (referral, not kick on losses). And I guess since I'm not the bright one in this conversation, please explain to me. Are you saying the services purposely give out the "wrong/losing" side so they get a kickback from losses? B/c if they were that smart and good, wouldn't it make more sense for them to give out the "right/winning" side and collect lots from their happy clients?

[savage1]

Winner-first of all actually I enjoyed reading your posts, and some of your posts actually "upon further review'' gave me something to think about and brought up things I hadn't even considered like pitchers throwing a wild pitch to cover the over.
Obvioulsy I don't think anywhere near all games are fixed (perhaps just a tiny percentage where the situation and/or the money bet could entice a player(s) who is aware of the line to try to make a game come out a certain way for maybe just egotistical purposes;I don't think there is a big conspiracy before each game between all the players, refs, etc. to try to make a game come out a certain way.
If nothing else, I thought at the very least the games I presented as examples would be ones which could lend themselves to manipulation, and as stated I personally beleive that Laker games especially over the last 4-5 years are suspect at times and are as I stated the reason that i don't bet on them as a general rule.
Regarding services, your logic is good except that I personally think most sports services are on the decline and will be extinct in the next few years as more and people find out that their picks are available for nothing on a number of sites on the internet;thus I don't agree with your contention about happy clients.
I will admit that as i stated before that I have a sense of skepticism and cynicism about a lot of things in life which include sports gambling at times;the fact that a good part of my job before I retired involved investigative work(investigating food stamp recipients for example) may contribute to my overall sense.
And oh yes, most of my time during the day is spent watching stocks and at time trying to trade them;talk about market manipulatiob by the market makers on a daily basis-anything about sports gambling I say pales in comparison.
Anyways, I guess to coin the old cliche we will just have to agree to disagree, and I will admit that much of what I say could be speculation(although I believe it does happen).
If I said anything yesterday which was offensive to you or anyone else, I apologize.
I am not infallible for sure, and just the fact that you and several others expressed some opposing views with some valid points shows that what I say is by no means a slam dunk and gave me some things to think about and consider.
ps I think personally the subject has been exhausted at this point, and I am not going to update this thread if I see another game where I think something could be fishy;hopefully everyne who contributed to or read this discussion hopefully will derive something no matter who they agree with and have some food for thought;I did for sure.

[CheechB03]

There have been admitted attempts to fix games in the past, which tells me that a lot more goes on that you DON'T hear about.

Where is there a documented case that an attempt to fix a NBA game had been made?

Savage, as often as you scream fix or claim a game was fishy don't you think if the games were fixed as often as you claim we'd hear about it? Someone would have talked by now.

[CheechB03]

I just find it a little strange that 35 points were scored the other night in 4:45 minutes(putting game over the total), whereas tonight only 34 points were scored in around the last 9 minutes where Miami had at least an outside chance of getting back in the game late and then game falling short by 2 points of going over the total and very few points scored late.

What's so strange about 35 points being scored? I've seen 20 points scored in the last 1 1/2 minutes of the game.

Savage, do you really think that if the total was 'fixed' they wait until the last 4+ minutes of the game to score? Think about it. As I said the other day. In the Lakers/Suns game except 2 all of the Suns points were long range jumpers. Once again, if the fix was on would they be taking low percentage shots.

I've seen games where both teams don't combine for 30 points in the entire 4th quarter. What's so strange about last nights game. If you look at the box score you'll notice the teams scored less points in the 3rd than the 4th.

[WayneChung]

I didn't say anything about expressing your opinion, I said something about the foolishness for someone to bet on what they truly believe to be a fixed game. Would you play cards at a table where you thought they were marked, or throw dice at a table that you thought had loaded dice?

Do I believe services are corrupt? Yes, I think many if not most are. They are more concerned about marketing and new clients and not winning. Do I think they get a kickback for referrals. Probably. Similiar to the arrangement here at this site I would assume (referral, not kick on losses). And I guess since I'm not the bright one in this conversation, please explain to me. Are you saying the services purposely give out the "wrong/losing" side so they get a kickback from losses? B/c if they were that smart and good, wouldn't it make more sense for them to give out the "right/winning" side and collect lots from their happy clients?

winner,where are you going with this,if you have read any of mine and savage's post,we constantly expose how corrupt the services are,the big guys like UNCLE P H I L get huge kickbacks from the business they send the sportsbook they promo.to your question,WHY DO WE CONTINUE TO BET IF WE FEEL THAT WAY,YOU HAVE CLOSE TO A 50-50 PERCENT CHANCE OF BEING ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE "MAFIA JOE." THAT WAS A JOKE,I AM NOT SAYING ALL GAMES ARE FIXED.truthfully,if we are honest with ourselves 90 percent of us are addiction freaks to one degree or another,its just that over the years we learn to manage a little better,cap a little better,and a few others that makes betting sports enjoyable.GUYS WHY DON'T WE LET THIS HORSE REST,I THINK WE'VE RODE HIM ENOUGH AND MOVE ON TO THE MAIN PURPOSE OF THIS FORUM-BEATING THE MAN!! SINCERELY WAYNECHUNG!!

[savage1]

What's so strange about 35 points being scored? I've seen 20 points scored in the last 1 1/2 minutes of the game.

Savage, do you really think that if the total was 'fixed' they wait until the last 4+ minutes of the game to score? Think about it. As I said the other day. In the Lakers/Suns game except 2 all of the Suns points were long range jumpers. Once again, if the fix was on would they be taking low percentage shots.

I've seen games where both teams don't combine for 30 points in the entire 4th quarter. What's so strange about last nights game. If you look at the box score you'll notice the teams scored less points in the 3rd than the 4th.

My point is that I thought it unusual for teams to score 35 points in last 4:45 og game when one team was leading by 30.
Usually coacjes tell whoever is playing to slow the game down no matter if subs are playing or not;the fact that the 35 points put game over the total when a lot of money was bet on this particular game(national tv, playoff, etc.) at he very least raises my suspicions.
To play devil's advocate, one could argue that three point shots were taken as opposed to regular shots because so many points were needed in a short period of time if the game was to have any chance of going order.
In most cases when the 20 minutes are scored in a minute and a half, I would bet that the team was close and not like the blowut the other night.

Last night in comparison was just the oppposite-Miami rallied late to at least make a game of it and by my way of thinking, this situation is one where a lot more fouls and points should have been scored.
As stated, my skepticism and cynicism reflects and is a further extension of the curruptness of what goes on in this country on a much important level.

[mmw151]

how do you know how much money was bet on the over as oppsed to the under???

and the miami game they were down by 11-13 pts with a lil over a minute left, there is no reason to foul the game is over.
savage, what would u have said if vince cartere hit the 3 at the end of the game to send it over?