It's Official ... Sabathia to Milwaukee

[Three Jack]

[/RIGHT]
Also, I researched stats. and found not to my surprise that Sabathia is 1-7 lifetime against the Yankees with a 7.13 ERA.
By my way of thinking, he is good but not great and not worthy of all the attention he is getting.
He may help Milwaukee in the inferior National League, but then again a lot of pitchers could.

Are the Yankees the only good team in the AL the last 7 years? How did he do against the Red Sox? White Sox? A's? Twins? Angels?

Let's not forget he beat the NYY in the playoffs last year, if that is who you want to use as your benchmark.

[savage1]

wellllll I would say that he's better than just "good" , he may not be great but he's one of the more dominating lefty starters in the game right now. and I wouldn't call him the most overrated pitcher in the game, that title goes to..........mark buehrle

I think he is closer to good than dominating;I can't think of many pitchers present or past with whom I would use the word "dominating."

[molta02]

They weren't going to get fair value for a guy going into his walk year, where they have told the world they aren't going to re-sign him and when they weren't going to give the other team an opportunity to sign him prior to the deal. No doubt they were only going to get $.75 on the dollar...but at least they got $.75 that can turn into $1.25.

They aren't making the playoffs and te longer they wait, the less they would get. I thnk this is a good deal for both sides.

agreed.

[savage1]

Are the Yankees the only good team in the AL the last 7 years? How did he do against the Red Sox? White Sox? A's? Twins? Angels?

Let's not forget he beat the NYY in the playoffs last year, if that is who you want to use as your benchmark.

How did he do against the Red Sox in the playoffs last year?
How about 10 innings pitched, 17 hits allowed, 12 earned runs, 7 walks, 9 strikeouts-nice pitching with the season on the line!
All I know is that over the years, the Yankees have been considered the team to beat, and just about every time when Sabathia pitched against them, he came up short as the record indicates.
I am not saying he is not good, but great, I don't think so.
I realize this is a subjective call, but I simply don't believe he is anything more than a good pitcher.
If Cleveland considered him a steppingstone to winning a WS, they would not be willing to part with him so easily.

[BigWeiner]

agreed.

I agree also, but if I'm a GM, I trade him for a starting pitcher propect if possible. The reason they were good last year was because of CC and Carmona.

[Three Jack]

If Cleveland considered him a steppingstone to winning a WS, they would not be willing to part with him so easily.

Savage, this is such an idiotic statement...they offered him 4 yrs & $72 million...that doesn't tell you what they thought of him????? They didn't just shove him out the door! They offered him $18 million freakin' annually and you want to use that as an argument against his value?!?!?!!?!

They are not the only team that is not willing to give 6 and 7 yr contracts to pitchers.

As for your NYY stats, you may want to research the numbers before you regurgetate them. He is 1-2 with a 3.30ERA the last 4 years against the NYY. He got shelled his rookie year in two outings against them. Most of his beatings happened in his early years. Yes, he has an awful record against him but he has pitched well against them of late ('of late' being since 2004!!!).

And if you are going to use 2 outings in the playoffs to supplement your argument, why not look at the 8 innings 1 ER he gave up in Yankee Stadium in a loss earlier this year? Or take the whole body of work and how has he done against the Red Sox in his career? They have been better than the NYY since CC came into the league (I have no idea what his numbers against the Sox are).

I have no issue with your opinion as you mention it is subjective and, of course, it is an opinion. It is my opinion that the basis you use to get to that belief is seriously flawed.

Toodles...have a good night!

[Three Jack]

Found it...
2-4 3.90 ERA against the Sox...not great.

But 19-9 with a 2.88 ERA in Sept and Oct regular season games....

[savage1]

Savage, this is such an idiotic statement...they offered him 4 yrs & $72 million...that doesn't tell you what they thought of him????? They didn't just shove him out the door! They offered him $18 million freakin' annually and you want to use that as an argument against his value?!?!?!!?!

They are not the only team that is not willing to give 6 and 7 yr contracts to pitchers.

As for your NYY stats, you may want to research the numbers before you regurgetate them. He is 1-2 with a 3.30ERA the last 4 years against the NYY. He got shelled his rookie year in two outings against them. Most of his beatings happened in his early years. Yes, he has an awful record against him but he has pitched well against them of late ('of late' being since 2004!!!).

And if you are going to use 2 outings in the playoffs to supplement your argument, why not look at the 8 innings 1 ER he gave up in Yankee Stadium in a loss earlier this year? Or take the whole body of work and how has he done against the Red Sox in his career? They have been better than the NYY since CC came into the league (I have no idea what his numbers against the Sox are).

I have no issue with your opinion as you mention it is subjective and, of course, it is an opinion. It is my opinion that the basis you use to get to that belief is seriously flawed.

Toodles...have a good night!

Ok-I will admit I was wrong and did not realize that Cleveland offered him 72 million, which is absurd in my opinion to begin with.
Re: recent stats against the Yanks, if what you say is accurate, then he has pitched better.
On the other hand, his lifetime record of 1-7 against them tells me that something is amiss and goes wrong when he pitches against them-it could be hitting, errors, etc.-don't know what it is, but 1-7 is not good and by my thinking is disturbing.
In summary when I consider the tangibles and intangibles, I simply don't consider him to be a real winner when the stakes are high say as opposed to well, yeah Beckett.
The article I quoted shows his inconsistencies this season, and that is enough at this point to question what he will do going forward.
Personally, I think in time Cleveland will get the best of this deal.

[DDP713]

who cares what his numbers are against the yankees and redsox....how has he done against the cubs, cardinals and pirates ?

[Kaptain]

wayne1218

C.C. has only given up 8 ER's in his last 5 starts (40 innings) and he hasn't lost a game since June 5th. In his last 5 starts he also has 41 K's and only 6 walks. Sabathia is the current Cy Young Winner and he is eating up innings and he is also pitching just as good as anyone in baseball right now. He may have struggled early but that is behind him and you ARE GETTING the "Old" C.C. in this trade.

EXACTLY....It's what was said in POST 14, agreed by me in POST 17, and then we go to

POST 21 from NARCISSUS himself, who can't seem to talk with out some kind of CHILD LIKE mannerisms.....

what a tool he is.....I bet every member here is proud to read his SASSY ass comments....

DID you say, PARANOIA, NARCISSISSISM, EGOTISM, etc.....

GEEZ.....will it ever stop.....

[PhilJr]

YOUR HARD ON FOR ME IS PROBABLY THE BIGGEST ERECTION YOU HAVE ACCOMPLISHED IN YOUR ENTIRE LIFE


SO....WE THROW OUT THE FIRST MONTH OF THE SEASON TO MAKE OUR NUMBERS LOOK BETTER NOW?


ALL I SAID IS CC ISNT PITCHING THIS YEAR LIKE HE DID IN THE PAST FEW YEARS

6-8 WITH AN ERA NEAR 4 ISNT SEBATHIA - LIKE

GEEZ

Maybe part of that record is due to the fact that in 11 out of his 18 starts, Cleveland has scores 2 runs or less. Tough to win games like that

[Chado1]

Maybe part of that record is due to the fact that in 11 out of his 18 starts, Cleveland has scores 2 runs or less. Tough to win games like that

Agreed and the Brew Crew can give him more run support with their offense in which the Indians could not...

[Spark]

Agreed and the Brew Crew can give him more run support with their offense in which the Indians could not...

Cleveland has scored no more than two runs for him in 11 of 18 starts .....

Cubs better now watch out for Mil ... they certainly have a true contender ... Nice move by the Brewers for the second half ,.,, Sabathia will fit right in if Sheets goes down .. and we all know that Sheets is injury prone ... but if he stays healthy they will have a hell of a 1-2 punch on that starting rotation ...

damn it

[Kaptain]

CC's STATS

CC's stats to date are....

Starts 18
Won 6 lost 8
ERA 3.83....and this includes the early season bad start....he's been lights out of late, just gets no run support.....If he'd be witht he Rangers, he might just be 17-1 ....Rangers can score...

Innings Pitched 122.1
Gave up just 54 runs
2 Shutouts
3 complete games

here's the amazing stat...
123 Strike outs to just 34 Walks....

Yeh, he's over the hill.....He's gonna be a great asset to the Brew Crew, and as I said, if they get him runs, he'll make a difference......Hope so, cause they're paying him enough

[Kaptain]

Papi

Cleveland has scored no more than two runs for him in 11 of 18 starts .....

Cubs better now watch out for Mil ... they certainly have a true contender ... Nice move by the Brewers for the second half ,.,, Sabathia will fit right in if Sheets goes down .. and we all know that Sheets is injury prone ... but if he stays healthy they will have a hell of a 1-2 punch on that starting rotation ...

damn it

It won't affect the Cubs any PAPI, cause the Brew Crew will start their # 5 Pitcher against them......

Save CC for the tough ass teams...

Hope that didn't hurt too much PAPI, just had to do it....