Op-Ed *** Iraq *** Sad but True .....

[Ldawg]

Sadly , I have to agree w/this assessment ....




http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercu...n/12403157.htm

[BigWeiner]

I don't wanna sign up for the Mercury News website, can you copy and paste the story?

[Ldawg]

I don't wanna sign up for the Mercury News website, can you copy and paste the story?

Sorry BW ...site won't allow copying ..... I can email article to Monte or Spark .... and hope that they will post for us !!

P.S. SJMN does not send Spam / JFYI

[Ldawg]

Rah haa got it .....

By Trudy Rubin


Cindy Sheehan is right to be furious.

Camped out in Crawford, Texas, with several other mothers who lost sons in Iraq, Sheehan wants to meet President Bush. She says: ``Our sons made the ultimate sacrifice, and we want answers.''

I understand why Bush doesn't want to meet Sheehan. She wants him to pull U.S. troops out of Iraq. But the president can't pull the troops out. He can't even make the substantial reductions that some of his top brass are predicting for early next year. If he does, he risks disaster for Iraqis while boosting the cause of jihadist terrorists.

And Bush can't afford to tell the mothers why he's caught in this trap.

If Bush met Sheehan, platitudes would not suffice. She would want to know why 140,000 U.S. soldiers are stuck in Iraq more than two years after the fall of Baghdad. She would demand answers that go beyond ``Freedom is on the march.''

The president is not willing to give those frank answers. If he were, here's what he would have to say (translated from Bush-ese):

``Mrs. Sheehan, our troops are mired in Iraq because of errors made by my team. The Pentagon made no plans for the postwar. We sent too few troops to secure Iraq after Saddam fell, despite prewar warnings by top U.S. generals. This created a power vacuum, into which rushed former Baathists who want to restore the old order, along with Iraqi criminals and Arab jihadis.

``I admit we failed to recognize the danger of this power vacuum. We disbanded Iraq's army, rather than let Iraqis revamp it. This required us to build new Iraqi security forces from scratch, a mammoth task that only got going in June 2004.

``Those new Iraqi forces are far, far from ready to fight alone.

``The real truth is we were wrong to think we could build a new Iraqi army like kids build with Legos. Building an army takes more than sending equipment and trainers. We forgot that we were dealing with human beings in a country very different from ours.

``One of our fine retired U.S. generals, Barry McCaffrey, who visited Iraq in May, summed it up just right: `Here's the real shortcoming of the Iraqi forces: Do they collectively believe it's worth fighting and dying for Iraq?' Iraq is so split by religious and ethnic conflicts that many Iraqi soldiers don't know what they're fighting for.

``So we are caught in an awful bind, Mrs. Sheehan. Our military has concluded we can't defeat this insurgency by force. We don't have the manpower or the intelligence resources. We've badly over-stretched our National Guard, along with our Army and Marines.

``But if we leave now, Iraq will disintegrate, maybe into full-scale civil war. The Kurds will take the north. The Shiite majority, who were our tacit allies, will take the south and most of the oil and ally with Iran. Worst of all, the Sunni chunk of the country will become a nightmare zone, where Arab terrorists train for attacks against our Arab allies, their oil wells and Israel.

``The Iraqi terrorist threat that didn't exist before we invaded will truly haunt the region. We will have created a monster.

``And, once more, we will have betrayed the Iraqis. Reagan let Saddam gas the Kurds; my father let Saddam slaughter the Shiites after urging them to rebel. Now I'll be responsible for taking out Iraq's institutions and leaving chaos behind.

``So when can our troops come home, you ask?

``It's up to the Iraqis.

``No, no, I'm not trying to brush you off, Mrs. Sheehan.

``You see, the Iraqis are drafting a constitution that's supposed to be finished. If Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds can only agree on a federal formula for sharing power, they can move forward to elections in December. If key Sunni leaders can be brought into the political process, that will undercut the insurgency, which is largely made up of disgruntled Sunnis.

``Then maybe we can draw down the troops.

``Yes, I know this is expecting a lot. Yes, I know Iraq is on the brink of civil war. I agree I overplayed the chance of democracy in a country with no experience of political give-and-take.

``Gen. McCaffrey had it right when he told columnist Trudy Rubin that `if the (Iraqi) political process doesn't work, we're screwed.'

``We're damned if we leave, and we may be damned if we stay, but we have to stick it out in force until next summer. By then, we'll know if the Iraqis can get their act together. If not, we'll be in big, big trouble.

``Who's to blame, you ask? Why haven't I fired Don Rumsfeld? Why haven't Paul Wolfowitz or Douglas Feith taken any heat for their gross mismanagement of the postwar?

``There's a limit to frankness, Mrs. Sheehan. I sympathize with your loss, but I really have to get back to my vacation. . . .''

TRUDY RUBIN is a Philadelphia Inquirer columnist and editorial-board member.

[BigWeiner]

Great article, thanks for sharing

[frankb03]

More left wing liberal propaganda bull shit.

I'd like to ask Cindy Sheehan a question. Why did her son join the service?

[RJeremy]

good point frank. this lady has every reason to mourn and be upset her son is gone. but he joined on his own free will

[TwoTonTony]

yeah the war sucks...yeah it really sucks her son died....but as a military man you join the service and you follow orders....not just the ones you think are okay with your ideals.....all military men and women know this.......it is all vounteer last i checked....i am ex-military and am not happy about the situation over there.....but people die in the war business and by the way he has already met with her twice....there is nothing more to be gained by a meeting.......

remember in anything....hindsight is 20/20

[te14]

I sympathize with Sheehan's grief but when you allow your protest to become so politicized with the likes of moveon.org and the Michael Moore's of the world, credibility takes a hit. War is a tough business and this has become tough for the American people to take. I'm nt sure we have the stomach for war anymore. What I hate most of all is that it is starting to look like our decisions will ultimately be based on the media's strength and a one-sided view of how things are going.

[jcindaville]

I dont like the war either. Did we make a mistake by going there? YES, but finish what you start, you make a mess, YOU clean it up, and Bush is trying to do that. I pray for that situation to come to some type of decent conclusion, but think that it will never be. How can you bring democracy to a Godless society, muslims believe that strapping a bomb to their bodies, and going into a market and killing innocent civilians will allow them to set at the right hand side of allah and have 3 virgin wives. Think about this guys, if you truely believed that your lord would have you right beside him in Heaven, with every amenity ever imaginable, you telling me you wouldnt go and suicide bomb some cafe in the name of your lord. of course you would. That is why you cant democracize these people, their God is not God, they dont know the truth.This is just my opionion, If you want to know i voted for Bush, both times.

[littlebear]

lot of truth to that article. call it bullshit if you want to, but I don't hear anyone refute the content

[Ldawg]

More left wing liberal propaganda bull shit.

I'd like to ask Cindy Sheehan a question. Why did her son join the service?

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People ARE dying .... propaganda Bullshit ?? Dying for WHAT ? To cover W's ass ?

I think Cindy brings dishonor to the memory of HER son who died Honorably !! Cindy IS NOT the point here ass wipe !!!

Your so fucked in the head Frank ....if I HAVEN'T MADE IT CLEAR IN THE PAST FRANK ... LET ME MAKE IT CLEAR NOW .....STAY THE FUCK OUT OF MY THREADS 'CAUSE I DON'T REALLY GIVE A GNAT'S ASS WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT ANYTHING !! YES YOU'RE CERTAINLY ENTITLED TO YOUR FUCKED UP OPINION BUT TAKE IT SOMEWHERE ELSE !!

[LVJimmy]

More left wing liberal propaganda bull shit.

I'd like to ask Cindy Sheehan a question. Why did her son join the service?

Not sure I understand what Frank is getting at, but that was kind of a harsh reply Tom...lol. In all seriousness, I'm in the military, and I can obviously sympathize with the mother here, but I don't agree with what she's doing. I will admit that I'm the biggest momma's boy ever, and my mom loves me so much, more than I will ever realize. Despite this, if I was to ever die in combat, (knock on wood), regardless of the reason we're there, I know she would never pull a stunt like this. Although she constantly begs me not to volunteer to go to Iraq or the other hell-hole, she also knows that if I ever do have to go over there, it is PART OF MY LIFE NOW THAT I'M IN THE MILITARY AND SHE WOULD ACCEPT IT.

It's even hard to get a concensus of military members opinions one way or another regarding the situation in Iraq. Personally, I don't feel like we made a mistake going over there, but I do think we executed a failed plan. We can't just pull out now though, I know that much. I pray all the time that this shitty situation will end soon.

The one thing I can't stand about the whole ordeal is that it seems even our media portrays all the bad things about the US military being in Iraq, but they never show any of the good things. Despite what you may see on TV, there is a LARGE population of Iraqis that are happy we did what we did. For some reason, the media fails to give a damn about that part though.

[frankb03]

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People ARE dying .... propaganda Bullshit ?? Dying for WHAT ? To cover W's ass ?

I think Cindy brings dishonor to the memory of HER son who died Honorably !! Cindy IS NOT the point here ass wipe !!!

Your so fucked in the head Frank ....if I HAVEN'T MADE IT CLEAR IN THE PAST FRANK ... LET ME MAKE IT CLEAR NOW .....STAY THE FUCK OUT OF MY THREADS 'CAUSE I DON'T REALLY GIVE A GNAT'S ASS WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT ANYTHING !! YES YOU'RE CERTAINLY ENTITLED TO YOUR FUCKED UP OPINION BUT TAKE IT SOMEWHERE ELSE !!

Tom FUCK YOU!

If you don't want replies that differ from your opinion than don't start threads. As far as staying out of your threads once again I say...........


FUCK YOU

[frankb03]

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Your so fucked in the head Frank

I'm fucked up in the head because I dffer with your opinion?

Before you post listen to what people in the military have to say. Listen to the likes of SFLINSJ. Don't listen to BS written by some left wing liberal who's sitting on his ass in a cushy office spewing his BS and has no clue about what's going on in Iraq.

Oh Tom by the way FUCK YOU