iF YOUR A YANKEE FAN

[TwoTonTony]

Bryan, TTT just doesn't know or understand what "IT" is. It's not his fault so we won't blame him!!!

I get what IT is......believe me.....I did not say he did not have the supporting cast.....I said there are other factors....like losing to the teams that won the super bowl....new england and pittsburgh.......I am not defending him....I just think people are too harsh to judge.....He is a top performer.....year in and year out....he will get his ring.....It is easy to judge as a fan.....I know you are the biggest homer in the world and if i kicked brady in the ass it may break your nose....but you have to admit that manning is the 2nd best qb in the league....

As far as montana he is one of my all time favorites....My point was that it is impossible for any QB to succeed when he is on his back.....I just happen to remember that game...It was in response to the comment that great QB's rise above that...give me a break....nobody can perform on their ass.......As it was he almost pulled it out on his own in the 4th quarter.....In the Pats games He choked...YES big time...Against the steelers i think he was let down by his team and the coaching staff....the game plan sucked...

So you do not have to excuse me for not getting IT....

[TwoTonTony]

TTT,

Manning had the supporting case for the past 4 years. Last year he had a solid top 5 D. harrison,wayne,stokley,Edge,vanderShank and a O line that protected him all "regular season" long. Bottom line is, the guy comes up small time and time again when it counts most. If you dont think so you must not be watching the games.

As far as montana goes? that game your referring to is 1 game, 1 time....So what? Montana has multiple rings, MVP awards and I believe he was the QB for "the catch" do you remember that????? Come on TTT.....manning shouldnt even be mentioned in the same sentence as Montana.


PS IMO elway didnt have "it" Terrell Davis did. W/O davis elway never wins JACK.....elway should thank Davis for getting him 2 titles.

next question

and vice versa....elway has more 4th quarter comebacks than anyhone in history......Denver always had undersized teams and when they played the NFC they were simply manhandled.....Thank the GM and owner for getting a running game.....But do not kid yourself that TD made Elway...that is absurd!!!

[TwoTonTony]

[QUOTE=10DimeBry]TTT,

Manning had the supporting case for the past 4 years. Last year he had a solid top 5 D. harrison,wayne,stokley,Edge,vanderShank and a O line that protected him all "regular season" long. Bottom line is, the guy comes up small time and time again when it counts most. If you dont think so you must not be watching the games.

As far as montana goes? that game your referring to is 1 game, 1 time....So what? Montana has multiple rings, MVP awards and I believe he was the QB for "the catch" do you remember that????? Come on TTT.....manning shouldnt even be mentioned in the same sentence as Montana.


i watch the games.....And you think he had protection against the Steelers???? Is that what you are saying??? I thought that Manning almost single handidly brought them back in the 4th qtr and if it weren't for a Ben 1 armed tackle he would have a ring....So he would be a great QB if the DB broke free from Ben......All i am saying is that you are so quick to say he sucks and that is absurd.......He did come up small against the Pats alot....I agree...But do you not think Belechik had anything to do with it? So you are not giving any credit to the greatest D mind in modern football....A coach who definitely Has IT......It had something to do with Manning coming up small.....How bout that???? Even your boy Wayne would agree that belechik is the best......How you guys categorize men who are at the top of their game is ridiculous.I think you are harsh.....Other than Brady I would take Peyton Manning over any Qb in the league......

So do not dismiss me like i am a dummy........I would appreciate consideration for my opinion....because mine and yours are just that....opinions.....Only difference is I played against some guys who went on to the NFL.....


PS IMO elway didnt have "it" Terrell Davis did. W/O davis elway never wins JACK.....elway should thank Davis for getting him 2 titles.

[10DimeBry]

[QUOTE=TwoTonTony]

TTT,

Manning had the supporting case for the past 4 years. Last year he had a solid top 5 D. harrison,wayne,stokley,Edge,vanderShank and a O line that protected him all "regular season" long. Bottom line is, the guy comes up small time and time again when it counts most. If you dont think so you must not be watching the games.

As far as montana goes? that game your referring to is 1 game, 1 time....So what? Montana has multiple rings, MVP awards and I believe he was the QB for "the catch" do you remember that????? Come on TTT.....manning shouldnt even be mentioned in the same sentence as Montana.


i watch the games.....And you think he had protection against the Steelers???? Is that what you are saying??? I thought that Manning almost single handidly brought them back in the 4th qtr and if it weren't for a Ben 1 armed tackle he would have a ring....So he would be a great QB if the DB broke free from Ben......All i am saying is that you are so quick to say he sucks and that is absurd.......He did come up small against the Pats alot....I agree...But do you not think Belechik had anything to do with it? So you are not giving any credit to the greatest D mind in modern football....A coach who definitely Has IT......It had something to do with Manning coming up small.....How bout that???? Even your boy Wayne would agree that belechik is the best......How you guys categorize men who are at the top of their game is ridiculous.I think you are harsh.....Other than Brady I would take Peyton Manning over any Qb in the league......

So do not dismiss me like i am a dummy........I would appreciate consideration for my opinion....because mine and yours are just that....opinions.....Only difference is I played against some guys who went on to the NFL.....


PS IMO elway didnt have "it" Terrell Davis did. W/O davis elway never wins JACK.....elway should thank Davis for getting him 2 titles.

who said you were a dummy?? You're the one saying that i'm jumping to conclusions. Fact is i'm not. In college manning was a choke artist, Freakin Tee Martin QB'd tenn to a national title the year after manning left. Then as a pro manning time in and time out simply under performed. You cannot make excuses for it. No way, no how. Mannning didnt have protection vs. the steelers? your right. my point is.....if manning was so good, he would have simply made the necessary adjustments @ the line of scrimage and all would have been well. Fact is he didnt, and once again manning failed when it counts most. Just watch this year AAAAAgain and see for yourself.

[10DimeBry]

all things being 100% healthy....ie if all teams had equal talent and all players were healthy.

i'd take any of these 5 QB's over manning in a must win game.

T. Brady
C. Palmer
K. Warner
B. Favre
B. RothereoijaglkgofijhgofuogIcrashedMyBikeBurger

over manning every day of the week and twice on sunday

[TwoTonTony]

[QUOTE=10DimeBry]

who said you were a dummy?? You're the one saying that i'm jumping to conclusions. Fact is i'm not. In college manning was a choke artist, Freakin Tee Martin QB'd tenn to a national title the year after manning left. Then as a pro manning time in and time out simply under performed. You cannot make excuses for it. No way, no how. Mannning didnt have protection vs. the steelers? your right. my point is.....if manning was so good, he would have simply made the necessary adjustments @ the line of scrimage and all would have been well. Fact is he didnt, and once again manning failed when it counts most. Just watch this year AAAAAgain and see for yourself.

funny thing is i do not even like manning.....I just think many people judge a qb's career by rings and rings alone.....I agree he choked at Tennessee.....Maybe he gets over it....maybe not.....You make very valid points.....My main counter is to say in a team sport it is harder to define greatness sans ring...I think there are many greats who have lost.....Marino, Tarkenton to name 2........Manning is a poor example for me to use......He did/does have the surrounding cast......My point would have been better made with Elway....That sometimes you can only go so far without all the pieces.....And Elway was great...but even he could not overcome the Broncos giving away 30-40 pounds per man in the 4th qtr when the giants wore them out......I think it is easier to define IT (the original topic) in an individual sport or a sport where there are a lot less moving parts (hoops only 5 as oppossed to 22)......Tougher to carry a team like a Bird or Magic or Michael in footballl.....Sure, guys get on a roll...i.e. Simms 22-25 in Super Bowl.....but even if you carry the momentum the defense has to do their part as well........I just think of the Bills and how good those teams were and now they carry the stigma of losers for life because a kick went wide right.....Thanks for your views...

[kbsooner21]

all things being 100% healthy....ie if all teams had equal talent and all players were healthy.

i'd take any of these 5 QB's over manning in a must win game.

T. Brady
C. Palmer
K. Warner
B. Favre
B. RothereoijaglkgofijhgofuogIcrashedMyBikeBurger

over manning every day of the week and twice on sunday

warner maybe, favre?? you've lost you're mind. maybe 10 years ago

[BettorsChat]

TTT,

Manning had the supporting case for the past 4 years. Last year he had a solid top 5 D. harrison,wayne,stokley,Edge,vanderShank and a O line that protected him all "regular season" long. Bottom line is, the guy comes up small time and time again when it counts most. If you dont think so you must not be watching the games.

As far as montana goes? that game your referring to is 1 game, 1 time....So what? Montana has multiple rings, MVP awards and I believe he was the QB for "the catch" do you remember that????? Come on TTT.....manning shouldnt even be mentioned in the same sentence as Montana.


PS IMO elway didnt have "it" Terrell Davis did. W/O davis elway never wins JACK.....elway should thank Davis for getting him 2 titles.

next question

So what's your take on Marino??

[TwoTonTony]

all things being 100% healthy....ie if all teams had equal talent and all players were healthy.

i'd take any of these 5 QB's over manning in a must win game.

T. Brady
C. Palmer
K. Warner
B. Favre
B. RothereoijaglkgofijhgofuogIcrashedMyBikeBurger

over manning every day of the week and twice on sunday

I agree with your first one.....and maybe your 2nd.....Old Kurt Warner...maybe....Now he fumbles if he feels the defense on him.....Favre...the old one....Now...no way...his best days are way behind him and he is too much of a riverboat gambler with the ball.....

Big Ben ...maybe....maybe not.....he came up small in the Super Bowl...but you judge the win.......He did what was asked of him....Manning is a higher % of the Colts total offense than Ben is.....so i still would take Peyton.....

but i agree with Brady and Palmer

[10DimeBry]

[QUOTE=TwoTonTony]

funny thing is i do not even like manning.....I just think many people judge a qb's career by rings and rings alone.....I agree he choked at Tennessee.....Maybe he gets over it....maybe not.....You make very valid points.....My main counter is to say in a team sport it is harder to define greatness sans ring...I think there are many greats who have lost.....Marino, Tarkenton to name 2........Manning is a poor example for me to use......He did/does have the surrounding cast......My point would have been better made with Elway....That sometimes you can only go so far without all the pieces.....And Elway was great...but even he could not overcome the Broncos giving away 30-40 pounds per man in the 4th qtr when the giants wore them out......I think it is easier to define IT (the original topic) in an individual sport or a sport where there are a lot less moving parts (hoops only 5 as oppossed to 22)......Tougher to carry a team like a Bird or Magic or Michael in footballl.....Sure, guys get on a roll...i.e. Simms 22-25 in Super Bowl.....but even if you carry the momentum the defense has to do their part as well........I just think of the Bills and how good those teams were and now they carry the stigma of losers for life because a kick went wide right.....Thanks for your views...

true individual sports are alot easier to define "it". we can agree to disagree on this one. Lets go back to rippin Savage......lol j/k

[BettorsChat]

all things being 100% healthy....ie if all teams had equal talent and all players were healthy.

i'd take any of these 5 QB's over manning in a must win game.

T. Brady
C. Palmer
K. Warner
B. Favre
B. RothereoijaglkgofijhgofuogIcrashedMyBikeBurger

over manning every day of the week and twice on sunday

Warner? Favre? I would have to say Favre isn't the same player anymore.

Only one I would take is Brady.

[TwoTonTony]

So what's your take on Marino??

My take on Marino is that he was a great QB..Some people say he never had a good running game to compliment him or a dominant defense either......According to this criteria i imagine he is simply just good....But in my mind there are not many qb's i would rather have behind center than him.....I do not believe that Rings is the sole criteria of greatness in a team sport such as football

[wayne1218]

[QUOTE=10DimeBry]

who said you were a dummy?? You're the one saying that i'm jumping to conclusions. Fact is i'm not. In college manning was a choke artist, Freakin Tee Martin QB'd tenn to a national title the year after manning left. Then as a pro manning time in and time out simply under performed. You cannot make excuses for it. No way, no how. Mannning didnt have protection vs. the steelers? your right. my point is.....if manning was so good, he would have simply made the necessary adjustments @ the line of scrimage and all would have been well. Fact is he didnt, and once again manning failed when it counts most. Just watch this year AAAAAgain and see for yourself.

NO DOUBT!!!

He couldn't beat FLA. or Win a BIG game at Tenn. either!

[TwoTonTony]

[QUOTE=10DimeBry]

true individual sports are alot easier to define "it". we can agree to disagree on this one. Lets go back to rippin Savage......lol j/k

Deal....alot more fun!!!

[BettorsChat]

marino i believe had "it" only problem was he didnt have the RB he needed to win. its hard to win big games when you only make it to 1 SB in your career. Not to mention bills/broncos going to SB almost every single year. unlike manning, i believe marino is a winner. if he had the weapons that manning had he'd have multiple titles now, regardless of what the Pats or steelers had to say about it

Then how can you say Elway was no good? Elway was and is known for being one of the best at coming back and winning games at the last minute. Along with him in that category are Marino and Brady.