Super Bowl: Steelers vs Packers (2/6)

[wayne1218]

Wayne,

What does this mean? That game ended up 9-0, right? Are you saying the Jets D shut them out, or Rodgers had a good game? Sanchez actually had more passing yards, I believe. I read this post a few times and I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. By the numbers as least, the Steelers have a better D, so if they couldn't really score on the Jets, shouldn't they be afraid of a better D? Its true that the Jets were shut out that game, but what does that have to do with Rodgers?

Sorry, I'm just trying to follow what point you're trying to make.

My point was simple. You sounded like they havn't played a top defense all year and not only have they, they won!

[wayne1218]

just can't see the steelers secondary stopping all the weapons the gb offense has.

the location of hte game is huge imo. This game being on a perfect field in perfect weather (indoors) is a big advantage for gb. Pitt and ben seem to thrive in bad conditions.

I've seen aaron smith being brought up, total non factor in my opinion. He hasn't played a snap in three months

agreed!!!!!!!!

[atolunch]

My point was simple. You sounded like they havn't played a top defense all year and not only have they, they won!


Wayne, thanks for the response. I guess we'll agree to disagree, I think you make my point for me. Against a quality D, they managed 9 points and Rogers was highly ineffective. Tough game to use as a barometer though, if memory serves that was Halloween and I think it was windy as a muther.

Like they say, guess that's why they play the games, right.

Should be an entertaining game, and yes, I will be rooting for as Wiz Kahilfa says, the "Black and Yellow"

Good luck to you and all, with whatever you play.

Can't wait for the 5 pages of props to come out, I love this stuff!!!

[wayne1218]

My point was simple. You sounded like they havn't played a top defense all year and not only have they, they won!


Wayne, thanks for the response. I guess we'll agree to disagree, I think you make my point for me. Against a quality D, they managed 9 points and Rogers was highly ineffective. Tough game to use as a barometer though, if memory serves that was Halloween and I think it was windy as a muther.

Like they say, guess that's why they play the games, right.

Should be an entertaining game, and yes, I will be rooting for as Wiz Kahilfa says, the "Black and Yellow"

Good luck to you and all, with whatever you play.

Can't wait for the 5 pages of props to come out, I love this stuff!!!

They are 1 & 2 in the NFL in points per game on defense at 15.0 and 14.5

What makes the Pitt defense so much better? I just don't see it and neither do the numbers. On offense, the Packers are a better team. Plain & simple. I'm just trying to see this huge difference here on defense that you seem to see and i'm blind to it.

The Pitt D gave up 43 points in 2 home games (21.5 per) and the Packers D only gave up 51 in 3 on the road (17 per). Where is the dominance?

P.S. Love these discussions!

[azoire]

Super bowl time why do we bet?????????

[azoire]

Super bowl time go with ya gut?

[atolunch]

Green Bay avg 24 pts a game Steelers avg 23 and didn't have their starting QB for 4 games, and played a much tougher schedule. Where is it plain and simple that the Packers have a better O?

GB is completely one dimensional on O, and as I stated before, betting GB here is purely betting Rodgers who has never been on this stage before. IMO, I'll take the proven team, with the QB going for his 3rd ring over an unknown entity.

We saw last year where Brees won the game vs an experienced team so it can happen, but that's why they invented wagering. The teams are evenly matched so it may well come down to who makes the mistake, that's where I see Rogers blinking before Ben.

[wayne1218]

Green Bay avg 24 pts a game Steelers avg 23 and didn't have their starting QB for 4 games, and played a much tougher schedule. Where is it plain and simple that the Packers have a better O?

If you think a 1/2 point difference in points against makes pittsburgh worlds apart from Green Bay on defense, you have to really be amazed by the Packers offense with a full point advantage right?

GB is completely one dimensional on O, and as I stated before, betting GB here is purely betting Rodgers who has never been on this stage before. IMO, I'll take the proven team, with the QB going for his 3rd ring over an unknown entity.

One dimensional isn't a bad thing in this case. Nobody runs against Pittsburgh and that is fine with Green Bay because they don't care about running anyway. Pittsburgh is an average defense against the pass and when they faced guys like Brady & Brees, they lost by DD. Aaron Rodgers has the ability that they do to pick that secondary apart, meaning, that one dimension they have is perfect for this game. Also, a proven QB is great but nobody is proven until they win their 1st right? Peyton lost a SB, Brady also lost one recently and Big Ben is due too. The new breed of guys like Brees and Rodgers are putting their stamp on the league now.

We saw last year where Brees won the game vs an experienced team so it can happen, but that's why they invented wagering. The teams are evenly matched so it may well come down to who makes the mistake, that's where I see Rogers blinking before Ben.

Rodgers has been better than Ben all year. Even with the 4 games Ben missed, the averages still favor Rodgers and he was 1 of only 4 guys (3rd) who held a passer rating over 100 at seasons end. He was also sacked 1 less time than Ben in 4 more games. Ben has already proven he can look like shit in a Super Bowl. Luckily it was against the Seachickens and didn't matter but based on that, i don't know why you think Rodgers would blink 1st when Ben has already closed both eyes in a SB before!

[atolunch]

Again, you're just renforcing my points.

Rodgers has been better than Ben all year. Even with the 4 games Ben missed, the averages still favor Rodgers and he was 1 of only 4 guys (3rd) who held a passer rating over 100 at seasons end. He was also sacked 1 less time than Ben in 4 more games. Ben has already proven he can look like shit in a Super Bowl. Luckily it was against the Seachickens and didn't matter but based on that, i don't know why you think Rodgers would blink 1st when Ben has already closed both eyes in a SB before!
You may want to check your stats. Ben actually averaged 266 yds passing to AR's 261 and had only 5 picks to AR's 11. While its true AR had a passer rating of 101, Ben was 5th with a 97 rating, so I'm still not seeing the utter dominance of AR that you are.

Aaron Rodgers is Aaron Rodgers. He is not, Brady, Payton, Brees or even Ben. I'm betting that in this game he's remains Aaron Rodgers and is not ready yet to be considered one of the elite. Sounds like you believe he is, at least that's what every one of your points is based on, wild speculation. Time will tell. I'm not a big fan of DUE bets, but to each their own. I'll gladly watch Ben look like shit in the Super Bowl and raise his third trophy, again, reiterating my point that the Steelers have proven they can win without Ben at his best. The Pack has no shot in life of winning if AR isn't spectacular.

You can say what you like about the Steelers pass D, but you surely realize the numbers are skewered. Teams can't run against them so the passing number are naturally higher. Again, Ben has shown what he can do, even using your example of the Jets who you hold in such high regard, Steelers put up over 20 twice vs them, AR couldn't score on them. The Jets D had him confused and helpless, and the Steelers D is flat out better. 9 points doesn't win this SB.

[ravenmaniac]

Listen I don't like the Steelers as everyone knows but I do respect them as an organization and what they have done over the years. Tomlin may very well be the best coach in the NFL right now and if I had to win a big game I would take Rothlisberger over Brady, Manning or Brees. Having said that this game does not set up well for the Steelers. Brady and Brees picked them apart throwing crossing pattern to small quick receivers during the regular season. I think Rodgers does the same in spades. In addition I don't like Pitt's offensive line with Pouncy but without him Ben is gonna have to scramble a lot. Let's face it the Steelers play in the 2 playoff games has not been stellar. The fucking Ravens literally gave them that game. Steelers scored 7 points in the first half and the Ravens gave them 17 points with short fields on turnovers. Pitt's game against the Jets was similar to the Ravens game. Pitt got off to a big half time lead like the Ravens did with the difference being they didn't turn the ball over 3 times in their own territory like the Ravens did and were able to hold on for the win. Hell they didn't score a point in the second half. So in two playoff games they scored a total of 7 points in 4 quarters. Everybody focuses on the Packers offense with Aaron Rodgers but I love their defense. They were able to shut down Vick and Cutler which is more impressive than shutting down Flacco and Sanchez. Finally I wrote in another thread that I really do believe in karma. Ben is not winning his 3rd SB this year. JMO

[ironman95]

Raven:

Same coulds be said for the Steelers, you infer that the Ravens offense just went up and down the field. They did nothing the entire first half but led 21-7. At the end of the day, as Big Ben has said, it isn't pretty but they make plays when they have to, on both sides of the ball. Look at goal line stand against the Jets, look at the end of the game when they had to make plays to finish the Jets, look at the end fo the Az game in their last Super Bowl, look at last years game against GB....Should be a good game - I don't think the new found running game GB seems to have found is going to do anything and this will allow Pitt to play their D a little different to stop all those crossing routes, etc. A lot of people are doubting the Steelers, not like they haven't gone on the road and won 3 games before with Big Ben. Give LeBeau 2 weeks to dial up some D, as well as Capers and we'll see how this plays out. Everyone is saying how great GB is - not like they have lit up Chicago (10-3, 21-14, lost to the Lions for crying out loud 7-3). They are impervious to not playing well. Based on the feedback on here, even if Pittsburgh wins, it will be b/c what the Pack doesn't do - no credit to what the Steelers will have forced them into. Say what you will about Ravens giving them short fields - again, not what the Steelers did to cause it? As Wayne said, all this banter is great - for now. Will die off my week's end and pick back up next week.
No disrespect to any, just fun to see everyone's opinion. GL to all!
BTW - Under and teaser for Pitt/under

[garth]

I'm on the packers -2.5. I agree with the point that GB's offense and specifically Aaron Rogers will be the difference. Tough to go against the Steelers' organization, experience and history in the big game but that's the way I see it.

Great discussion in this thread.

[atolunch]

Its all really how you choose to look at it.

Some may say that the Steelers caused the Ravens 3 turnovers, and did it against arguably a better, and definately more proven playoff QB in Flacco than Rodgers. You can also use the flip side of that and say the Steelers scored 48 points in 4 Quarters against two D's that are better than what they will face in the SB.

I completely agree the Steelers O line is a mess, has been all year. It wasn't going to be good in the first place, then they lost 3 of those starters and had to fill in. Pouncy is huge and may prove to be the difference if he can or can't go.

Like I've stated several times, I really feel like if you're betting GB, you're putting all your eggs in Rogers basket. It would probably make sense if you put a prop bet in on AR for MVP. Odds won't be great, but better than the -110, just some food for thought.

As we all know, we can quote stats and make them say whatever we want them to. The bottom line is none of this means anything until they play the game. We put our hard earned dollars on the line and if we win, we're genius. If we lose, we can look back at our reasoning and say, they just didn't play well today.

Either way, its what we all love.

BOL to everyone, no matter what you ultimately play!!

[wayne1218]

Lunch, you continue to say that if you bet the packers, you are doing it based on all your eggs in one basket (rodgers). Why you continue to ignore the stout defense of the packers is seriously beyond me at this point. They may have only scored 9 vs the jets, on the road, but they shut their ass out and they are right behind pitt in points against and they are very equal to the steelers on defense. They too can win on defense but you refuse to acknowledge that. They have the nfl defensive player of the year the last 2 years and they are different guys. It is mind boggling to me that you say all packer bets are based on one player. That is simply put, absurd. Sorry but it is.

[BillMill71]

Disclaimer: I have not decided who I am betting on, but here are what I feel are some of the key match-ups that will decide this one (and it is not Ben vs Rodgers). For discussion purposes only

Steelers Def Front Seven versus GB O Line - I think this is a pretty big advantage Steelers. GB did only score 9 against the Jets and the Steelers front seven I feel is vastly superior to the Jets.

GB Def Front Seven versus Steelers O Line - I think GB front seven is as good as the Jets but not necessarily better. Even with a banged up line we saw how in the first half the Jets got pushed around. But Pouncy health impacted them mightly in the second half and Raji is much better than Pouha. This may prove to be pivotal.

Steelers Receivers verus GB DB - I think GB DB are very good. As a group I think they are better than either Balt or NYJ (as a group I said). So I think GB holds the advantage here.

GB Receivers versus Pitt DB - As good as the Pitt defense is overall I think with McFadden and Palo slowed, this group is REALLY not that good

Pitt Def Coordinator versus GB Off Coordinator - This I feel is where the game may be decided, and if that is the case GB Off coordinator is a little bit of a knucklehead some times and can cost them a tight contest with some stupid calls.