Reasons for Collapse of Red Sox

[kbsooner21]

[gizmo]

Thats true KB, LOL. For both me and Wayne im sure. The difference is I don't boo and I cheer my team on no matter what.Thats the difference I look at the good side and others want to attack someone.

He has a bad start you say get him next time or you just have to try or work harder or you say nothing.

You strike out with a man on third with less than 2 outs you tell him keep your head up your a good player you will get him.

You don't say your fat, a disgrace ,you suck,your a bum, I would rather have anyone else than you.

Thats the difference.

[wayne1218]

I find it hilarious that a so called baseball guy like yourself thinks era means nothing and wins are everything. That may be the dumbest thing I ever heard. The baseball writers and fans alike know the difference. If they didn't you wouldn't see 2 .500 pitchers like greinke and hernandez win the last 2 cy young awards in the AL. THEY DIDN'T WIN IT BECAUSE OF THEIR RECORD BUT THEIR ERA PLAYED A MAJOR FUCKIN ROLE GIZ. Wouldn't expect you to get that either though!

Bump for mr baseball. Why again are wins most important OVER era? You must have been a positional player cuz you know nothing about pitching.

[gizmo]

Wayne ,I am done trying to explain things to ignorant people and liars that misrepresent what others say.

Last ? for you ,would you rather have a team ERA of 4.60 and be 74-88 or have a team ERA of 5.60 and be 88-74. Thats how ERA does not mean as much as wins.

Its a team game we r not voting for an award here we r trying to get into playoffs.

Go BOO someone else

[gizmo]

and btw I have played every position at one time or another.

When I was younger I pitched,caught,played short and center as i got older I played left and 3rd and now I play 1st 2nd or dh

[wayne1218]

What won felix his cy young giz. Was it his 13-13 record or his era? Which carried more weight? I know it hurts to answer that truthfully but just try.

[wayne1218]

Also, is diesel just wrong too giz? Why don't you try to address and convince everybody and not just me?

[gizmo]

There you go again with your ignorance,you are again talking about an award .You want awards so bad, thats probably because you were never picked to be on a team.

Of course his ERA helped as did him leading the league in strikeouts,it also helped that there was only 1 20 game winner and he wasnt all that dominant.

So again you would rather have a 13-12 guythat wins an award than that 20 game winner.

You dont have to explain anymore I got you and the more you say the dumber you get so stop please.

[wayne1218]

Also, is diesel just wrong too giz? Why don't you try to address and convince everybody and not just me?

Dimer, savage, rob .... are we all just blind to what we see on the field giz or is it simply that we don't know because we didn't play the game at a high enough level?

[wayne1218]

No need to get upset brian. If you think we are all idiots just say it and be done with it. I'm pretty sure we all agree about lackey, not just me. Just get it off your chest and be done with it.

[gizmo]

As far as diesel, he has his opinion of what he thinks Lackey pitched well 5 times so what thats his opinion.I would say he pitched very well a minimum of 9 and thats my opinion. He won some of those 9 and lost some of those 9 and won some ok performances.

I have a problem blaming one guy thats responsible for being in 27 games and they won 12 of them.Thats what I have a problem with.

and again I dont think you understand so I will type this slower for you I never said his is a good pitcher but did pitch well enough in 18 games to get 12 wins.

[wayne1218]

He pitched long enough to get 12 wins, certainly not good enough. The offense was good enough to get him those wins. Nothing about his pitching is or has been good giz.

[gizmo]

Do you play cards, like no-limit holdem???

[diesel]

Gizmo bottom line no dissrespect to your knowledge of the game but he has been awful. He can't put hitters away and he leaves everything up. He is the biggest flop on this team and the number one reason that the playoffs are in jeopardy. He had to step up when Clay got hurt and he didn't do it. Yes there are other guys that didn't produce as they were expected Crawford, Drew come to mind but there offense until recently was so good what they did really didn't make a difference. They were 30 games over 500. Actually besides Lackey the only other culprit I see is Theo who has zero pitching depth in this organization. The Yankees just want a division title with sabathia, found a kid in Nova and a bunch of rethreads. All Epstein can come up with is Wakefield (45 years old) Bedard had good stuff but always injured and Kyle Weiland not ready for the makors and may never ne. Just pitiful job by Epstein

[gizmo]

Now for diesel thats a good argument, I can agree with injuries to Clay ,not Drew because he has been a disappointment also.

I would also agree with Theo being the biggest problem, I mean you can see Lackey struggling and Miller really come on and Wakefield he should be a long reliever or spot starter at most.So what with Weiland they took a shot and it didnt work.

The problem is Lackey is not 5-19 he is 12-12 and I repeat I know his ERA the most important thing in baseball to some is bad but I find it hard to blame a guy no matter how bad he is that wins half his games the reason the team is losing.

I would have had Aceves starting since July truthfully the only problem than is he may be the best guy in the bullpen also.