WLSF-Undervalued?

[savage1]

Wallstreet-as usual you make good sense.
Its funny-last night I had a feeling stock price was much too high for short run, but as you know did nothing.
The repair man was here, true, but I still had an opportunity and still do to save most of the profit.
If it breaks intraday low, I will probably sell some(I believe you said that).
I agree with your remarks about the stock split.

[savage1]

Wallstreet-I am almost embarrassed to ask you because I should know the answer, but since it has been a longtime since I had a stock with a split, I have a question re: the 3-1 stock split and record date with wlsf.
The record date is today and stock goes ex-dividend on 10/6.
What advantage/disadvantage is to having the stock (as I do) at the end of trading as opposed to not owning it and buying it in the interim between tomorrow and 10/6 or after for that matter.
I am confused, and if you could cite an example, it would be helpful.
Thanks and sorry for my ignorance/forgetfullness.
ps comment on how this made stock tumble today if it is not too much bother.

[wallstreet]

Savage,

Here is the press release today-

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040927/nym147_1.html

The date of record used to be a huge deal years ago, now it pretty much means nothing. In the past you had to own the stock before the date of record or you didnt get the stock split. Often times what happens is after the date of record but BEFORE the ex-date the stock will trade as if the split already happened. So for example, say you had DELL and it had a 2 for 1 split, say the stock was at 30 bucks for our example..well if the date of record was today, tomorrow the stock would trade at 15..and if the ex-div date was 5 days away, you dont get the shares until that point.

Now, companies do the date of record, ex-div date close to each other so it isnt an issue.

The drop..I cannot tell, they get pumped and dumped..that is what I see. Did you check out raging bull to see if there was any comments? Yahoo doesnt carry BB boards..

Wish I had better comments, but I feel worse you didnt get out when it crossed below 2. I hope you get another chance, maybe after the split the stock will go over that level.

It is 100X harder to sell than to buy..

Any other questions let me know..

[savage1]

Wallstreet-You are not kidding;it is so hard to sell when you see a big profit and then start to see it evaporate.
There were not too many comments on the Raging Bull thread-pretty much speculatiion and a little confusion and disappointment.
If you had an average basis of .90 for the 15000 remaining shares I have for this stock and did nothing like I did today when it plummeted from 2.34 to 41.87, what would you do tomorrow morning-what stop loss would you use and would you sell all or what portion and.or would you wait until split goes through?
I need help here, and whatever answer you give. it will be logically and unemotionally thought out;I don't trust my own judgment here.
I want to have a nice profit;it is now at around 17 K (counting shares I traded) as opposed to 24 K coming into today.
Believe me, if you tell me to sell X number of shares and I do and it goes up from there, I am not going to hold you responsible.:D
ps I have a bad track record of selling too late whether it be a profit or limiting a loss.

[wallstreet]

Savage,

We are the exact inverse. I always sell way way too early, usually missing upside potential. I get mad at myself, but I would take it over sitting on a loser. Dont take me wrong, I have losers all the time, but ever since I instigated a 20-25% buy per purchase (normally) I have done so much better than ever in the past. Now I average in and I average out..

Ok back to the issue at hand. I think the stock can go much lower..will it? We dont know and I sure dont..but what we can do and do know is how to place an order for a sell stop.

What at a MINNIMUM I would do is take that basis off the table..so take what you spent off the table on any strength..I hope you get strength to sell into...I hope you get strength and more and more and more.. but take what you have IN the trade out..for your sanity..if you ever get a nice gain like that you cannot ever get mad at yourself when you protect your original principal.

If you cannot be around then you gotta make that sell stop and pull up a 3 month chart-

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=WLSF.OB&t=3m

Look at the spike after Sept 13.. I wouldnt let it go below that...it breaks an uptrend and could lead back to support in the 1.30 area..

One thing that is scary...look at the volume..1.4 M and the stock dropped 21 percent..that means nearly all trading today was selling..

So do this..if you are feeling that pit in your stomach, sell your basis..we can talk in the morning about it..I am around after 10:30 EST or so..but if you want a level to sell more than your basis..use that spike as an exit..

Another thing..if the market goes lower, the speculative money leaves BB stocks quick..the extra money that the little guy uses to mess around...so if you sell now, I have to think you get chances at lower prices to get in again in the future..

If it were me and I had 17k on the table I would take half off..but I would have done that earlier and not seen the gains you have...so pick that sell stop and at least take 25% off the table.

See you in the morning and I hope it is a great open!!

[savage1]

Wallstreet-Thanks for that great advice.
To tell you the truth, even before you answered, i was taking the 15000 and multilplied ir by .90(average basis)=13500.
I think that is roughly what I make take off the table (roughly 1/2 of my remaining shares or 7500).
Lets see how it opens;I may need you!
Thanks again for your always helpful advice.
ps I am not sure you can place a stop order other than a mental one on a stock of this nature.

[savage1]

Wallstreet-Good morning.
I haven't done anything as stock is up, but am thinking of selling 5K shares.
How would you play this.
No stops or stop limits are permitted on this stock as you well know.
What would you use as a mental stop?
I am tempted to put order in to sell 5K of my 15000 shares at 2.00.
What do you think? Should I wait to see if it goes higher?
I would be very content to do that and let the other 10K ride.
I compromised;I just put in an order to sell 2500 shares at 2.00.
Lets see what happens;bid is 1.96/2.00.
I got it;now I will see what happens and sell another 2500 shares depending on what happens(commission is only 12.95-no big deal there).

[wallstreet]

Savage,

I see they had some news today, not sure if that is why the pop, but I take it and it beats being down..

Tecnically it didnt break the uptrend as it reversed right near that spike we talked about last night. But as you are also aware, this is a BB stock, is manipulated and can go in either direction and we wont know why..so playing safe with 17k in tow isnt a bad idea..

Taking 5k shares off the table isnt a bad idea, I do like taking your basis off, at least that is mentally booking gains so to speak and if you take that off, having to take the rest in a hurry isnt as painful as if you sold none.

The market looks whooped to me. We may get some end of quarter buying in certain sectors, but with oil going trader ballistic again and facing tougher Q over Q numbers, it will be hard to go too much higher.

[savage1]

Wallstreet-Thanks.
Profit is back up to around 20K with today's nice pop.
I am going to sell the other 2500 shares later.
I have a feeling with the election coming, the price of oio/gas is going to "mysteriously" drop right before the election to ensure Georgie gets re-elected;either that or Osama will be captured;kind of reminds me of pro wrestling if you get my drift.

[savage1]

Just sold another 1000 shares at 2.10-1500 more to go.
I just sold the remaining 1500 shares at 2.11-now I can relax and let the other 10000 shares(soon to be 30000 shares) ride.

[wallstreet]

Smart...

Now you can breathe a little easier!

[savage1]

Wallstreet-you are correct;although I still have 10000 shares left, I am happier that I sold 5000 shares at higher prices than the fact the price of stock has come down from its high;now I am in a position to trade if it retraces most of the move today;does that seem like a good idea?

[wallstreet]

Savage,

For me to get back into a trade right after I sold, the value really has to be there. So if the stock went to 1.70 or so, that might be a short term trading opp, but compared to your overall basis, buying more at much higher prices does little to lock in your gains.

Now if you sold the entire lot, then wanted to trade, thats a different story. But you still have plenty and I would want a big drop to get back in..even a little buy.

Does that make sense?

[wallstreet]

Savage,

I bot some ORBZ around 26 a share in after hours. Getting a 28 buck bid from Cendant all cash..

I can wait a few months for 2 bucks in a trade.

Bot 500 shares..no margin.

[savage1]

Wallstreet-I agree.$1.70 is at about the level I might consider buying;much over that makes no sense as you say.
Good luck in your trade;it sure looks like a good move;I hope you get at least a few points out of it if not a lot more.