Credo fought to end the war in iraq. At&t helped elect bush-cheney

[vols fan]

I don't get you man, or maybe I do and I just don't really want to. First of all, what wasn't correct above or means that I'd follow him off a cliff? 50 years from now, when we're dead and gone, he will be in the history books for the exact things I wrote. They aren't gonna remember a stimulus package or some legislation he tried to pass, but they will list ending two wars and effectively eliminating Bin Laden and Gadhafi for the most part and being the first African American president. There's no doubt in my mind. That WILL happen.

Second. You take these debates way too personally. This is good for the mind and stimulates discussion and knowledge and knowledge is power. Watchtower is a smart guy and debates well without taking personal shots. I appreciate that. I have no doubt there are individuals on here that don't like me because of my political views and stances I take and no doubt guys have changed their opinion of me because of my politics. It's too bad, but I'm not changing and I decided long ago that I don't really care what people think about me. Most of my family are Republicans and we just avoid discussions such as these. This is the internet however, and we're all faceless names in the crowd. SO I guess it's easy to get pissed at a screen name or internet personality. Funny thing is, another site I get on for betting has mostly Libs. Here it's just the opposite.

As far as being Liberal, most of all the things Republicans stand for have no interest to me. I care about the environment and cleaner air, I care about human rights, I believe in social security, medicaid, medi-cal. I believe in a women's right to have an abortion. I believe in everyone paying their fare share of taxes, I believe it is time to end government handouts to the rich and corporations and close loopholes in the tax code. I believe in stem cell research, I believe everyone in this country should have health care and an affordable means to get health care(less burden on taxpayers), I think we should end any tax credits or impose a labor tariff on any corporation shipping jobs oversees.

None of those fit the Republican ideology really, and so I will back the person that most closely does. And Obama does on almost all those things. He's pushed for some of those issues, some harder than others. He failed miserably with an issue that hits close to home for me, but so has every president since 1915.

I will always pull for the underdog and the lower half. That's just how I am. I will always want more for the less fortunate. I've pulled for people on here that I feel have gotten a bad shake. I even thought guys weren't being fair to you and KB in the Jr thread. It's why I became a journalist and I sleep better at night knowing that.

Anyhow, hate me or whatever floats your boat. I don't really hate anyone on here. Just really irritated with some stupidity at times. I know you're a good guy, we're just on opposite ends of what we believe in. Nothing wrong with that, it's what makes the world go round. I enjoy these debates sometimes. I don't like when it gets personal and if someone crosses the line, they get both barrels.

Sorry for the lengthy dissertation...

Merry Christmas by the way. This is gonna be a slim year my friend.

KAZ

Me saying you make it damn hard to like you is nowhere near me saying I hate you. I do take it personal when I'm asked how much I make and I shouldn't vote for someone cause of my income. It's funny that when you listed you values and what you look for in a candidate your salary wasnt one of the options. I share some of the same values that you listed. I agree about the government handouts to the rich. I also don't think we should be giving all these government handouts to the poor either. Will you answer me 1 question about this tax debate? If this was a republican president and a democratic congress do you believe they would be doing exactly what Boehner and Obama are doing? I think 100% yes.

[KazDog]

Me saying you make it damn hard to like you is nowhere near me saying I hate you. I do take it personal when I'm asked how much I make and I shouldn't vote for someone cause of my income. It's funny that when you listed you values and what you look for in a candidate your salary wasnt one of the options. I share some of the same values that you listed. I agree about the government handouts to the rich. I also don't think we should be giving all these government handouts to the poor either. Will you answer me 1 question about this tax debate? If this was a republican president and a democratic congress do you believe they would be doing exactly what Boehner and Obama are doing? I think 100% yes.

Tough to say. I think Republican's have stonewalled Obama a lot more than when Democrats were the majority in Congress and there was a Republican in office.

And for the record. I think what Monte said was one of the more brilliant things he's written on here. If you're making less than $150k and voting Republican, you have no a clue about politics. In my eyes they just aren't making it easier or profitable for lower income workers in this country. They think giving to the rich will take care of the poor or create jobs. It just doesn't work. I think that's why Monte asked about what you make. I don't think he was being malicious.

And, if there was one guy that I'd follow off a cliff, it would have been Clinton. He's flat out a genius and by far the smartest pres we've ever had. That guy can give a 3 hour dissertation on any topic without a teleprompter or notes. His knowledge is endless. Too bad he was sabotaged. Lord knows, back in the day, every pres dipped his pen in the company ink. People just looked away back then. But that guy was the shit. I could listen to him speak for hours, and when he's done, I feel like I'm much more informed.

KAZ

[vols fan]

I would take Clinton back in a new York minute.

[KazDog]

I would take Clinton back in a new York minute.

We're both on the same page there! I would no doubt take Clinton over Obama any day....

KAZ

[Watchtower76]

Tough to say. I think Republican's have stonewalled Obama a lot more than when Democrats were the majority in Congress and there was a Republican in office.

And for the record. I think what Monte said was one of the more brilliant things he's written on here. If you're making less than $150k and voting Republican, you have no a clue about politics. In my eyes they just aren't making it easier or profitable for lower income workers in this country. They think giving to the rich will take care of the poor or create jobs. It just doesn't work. I think that's why Monte asked about what you make. I don't think he was being malicious.

And, if there was one guy that I'd follow off a cliff, it would have been Clinton. He's flat out a genius and by far the smartest pres we've ever had. That guy can give a 3 hour dissertation on any topic without a teleprompter or notes. His knowledge is endless. Too bad he was sabotaged. Lord knows, back in the day, every pres dipped his pen in the company ink. People just looked away back then. But that guy was the shit. I could listen to him speak for hours, and when he's done, I feel like I'm much more informed.

KAZ

And what did obama do to push Obamacare down everyone’s throat, which was a complete disaster, especially after the 1500 pages of complete and utter shit…

Monte’s idea of 150k or less you have to vote for democrat, ARE YOU KIDDING me….If it was that easy kaz, obama would win 90% of this countries vote, and he should already have 49% of votes cuz it’s those who don’t even pay income taxes. And what solution do you have taxing the rich, when can they ease of the gas pedal and minimize govt, minimize what the fed is doing and stop spending……So it’s now on the rich for our gov’t wasted spending ARE YOU KIDDING ME RIGHT NOW….I’m so sick of putting it on the rich to cover up any gov’t spending, why don’t you attack the companies instead of the INDIVIDUALS…..Tax the rich, tax the rich blah blah blah…such a scapegoat statement

Oh now we go do Clinton, can I ask what he did so well…..let me guess the economy was just rocking when he left, and I suppose it’s bush’s fault that he walked into a shit storm called the “Dot.com” bubble…..that was created in clinton’s time and look what bush did during that time, and had 9/11 but for some strange reason, bush didn’t spend 5 trillion in 3 years, but it’s bush’s fault for the dot.com era I’m guessing…..

[Watchtower76]

Clinton vs Obama now, i'd take clinton in a second as well

[KazDog]

And what did obama do to push Obamacare down everyone’s throat, which was a complete disaster, especially after the 1500 pages of complete and utter shit…

Monte’s idea of 150k or less you have to vote for democrat, ARE YOU KIDDING me….If it was that easy kaz, obama would win 90% of this countries vote, and he should already have 49% of votes cuz it’s those who don’t even pay income taxes. And what solution do you have taxing the rich, when can they ease of the gas pedal and minimize govt, minimize what the fed is doing and stop spending……So it’s now on the rich for our gov’t wasted spending ARE YOU KIDDING ME RIGHT NOW….I’m so sick of putting it on the rich to cover up any gov’t spending, why don’t you attack the companies instead of the INDIVIDUALS…..Tax the rich, tax the rich blah blah blah…such a scapegoat statement

Oh now we go do Clinton, can I ask what he did so well…..let me guess the economy was just rocking when he left, and I suppose it’s bush’s fault that he walked into a shit storm called the “Dot.com” bubble…..that was created in clinton’s time and look what bush did during that time, and had 9/11 but for some strange reason, bush didn’t spend 5 trillion in 3 years, but it’s bush’s fault for the dot.com era I’m guessing…..

I doubt Obamacare gets in the history books. Sorry.

And how you don't get that if people who make over $250k pay even a small incremental amount of the taxes the rest of the country pays that we'd be out of debt in a minute is beyond me. It's not putting it on the rich, it's paying what everyone else has to. I'm so god damn sick of people living like kings, hoarding their money and dodging their obligation to pay a fair amount of taxes. THEY AREN'T AT HOME SUFFERING. And if they do pay a fair share, guess what? They'll STILL BE RICH!

What did Clinton do? How about create 23 million jobs during his presidency? Nuff said! Should we compare those numbers to Bush? No comparison. It doesn't matter what Obama does or did, or what Clinton did. They could cure cancer and you'd find fault. You're not a democrat. We get that. I thought ending the wars and eliminating two terrorists would have endeared Republicans to this guy, but not a chance.

KAZ

[Watchtower76]

I doubt Obamacare gets in the history books. Sorry.

And how you don't get that if people who make over $250k pay even a small incremental amount of the taxes the rest of the country pays that we'd be out of debt in a minute is beyond me. It's not putting it on the rich, it's paying what everyone else has to. I'm so god damn sick of people living like kings, hoarding their money and dodging their obligation to pay a fair amount of taxes. THEY AREN'T AT HOME SUFFERING. And if they do pay a fair share, guess what? They'll STILL BE RICH!

What did Clinton do? How about create 23 million jobs during his presidency? Nuff said! Should we compare those numbers to Bush? No comparison. It doesn't matter what Obama does or did, or what Clinton did. They could cure cancer and you'd find fault. You're not a democrat. We get that. I thought ending the wars and eliminating two terrorists would have endeared Republicans to this guy, but not a chance.

KAZ

When are you guys going to get off the high horse of taxing the rich and just tax the corporations that just have 1 person working in Switzerland and call it their (head quarters)…I’m so sick of this scapegoat of taxing people who make 250k but for some reason we bail out GE (GE CAPITAL) and what do they pay in taxes, F"N NOTHING, matter of fact we pay them back cuz of the write downs, MAYBE CHANGE THAT….

[Watchtower76]

AND FYI, i don't make even close to that...but i dont' think it's their problem for bailing out a gov't mess like this one has created, nor do i think it's them who have to pay more...TOP 10% already pay for 71% of our federal income, WHEN does the gov't say, enough is enough....

[KazDog]

AND FYI, i don't make even close to that...but i dont' think it's their problem for bailing out a gov't mess like this one has created, nor do i think it's them who have to pay more...TOP 10% already pay for 71% of our federal income, WHEN does the gov't say, enough is enough....

They may pay 70% of it or whatever, but they also have 95% of all the money in the country!

Flat tax! Never happen because the rich have no desire to pay the same as the rest of us.

I have no problem at all going after corporations. And while you're at it, penalizing the bastards for outsourcing jobs. THAT is why there are no jobs here. Greedy corporate pigs. Too much is based on wall street.

KAZ

[BettorsChat]

When are you guys going to get off the high horse of taxing the rich and just tax the corporations that just have 1 person working in Switzerland and call it their (head quarters)…I’m so sick of this scapegoat of taxing people who make 250k but for some reason we bail out GE (GE CAPITAL) and what do they pay in taxes, F"N NOTHING, matter of fact we pay them back cuz of the write downs, MAYBE CHANGE THAT….

I've told you twice now not to put words in my mouth that I didn't say.

[Spark]

Too late bro. That moniker was reserved for Dear jackass before him, who destroyed the country.

Obama will be remembered in history books first and foremost as the first black president and for ending 2 useless, costly wars, eliminating the most elusive and dangerous man to freedom around the world in Bin Laden and taking out Gadhafi after past presidents failed. He'll be remembered as a president who restored some amount of respect and credibility for the united states around the world after Dear Jackass had the world convinced that we are nothing more than warmongering, greedy pigs....

• Recovery Act saved and create jobs

• as promised - Unemployment rate will be 8.5% without stimulus.

• No Earmarks in the $787 Billion Stimulus

• closed Guantanamo bay

• didn't Raise taxes on those making less than 250,000 per year.

• the most transparent administration in History

• Went through the federal budget – page by page, line by line – eliminated those programs not needed, and insisted that those we do operate in a sensible cost - effective way.

• visited all 57 states

• got rid of earmarks

• When a bill landed on his Desk, The American people did get 5 days to review it before Obama signed it.

• created a 'super committee'

• 5 trillion more debt

• credit rating stronger than ever

Maybe if we give him a 2nd term he will do as promised.

[10DimeBry]

I have no problem at all going after corporations. And while you're at it, penalizing the bastards for outsourcing jobs. THAT is why there are no jobs here. Greedy corporate pigs. Too much is based on wall street.

KAZ

You really are clueless. That's a shame cause you are a good guy Kaz.

Fact..... Corporations don't pay penalties or taxes ....the consumer does in the form of higher prices for any product or service said corporation provides to the consumer. Corporations make profits for share holders or they go out of business period.

Fact....outsourcing jobs is due to over regulation and unions

[vols fan]

"Omonte" OMG Dimer!!!!!! That's the funniest thing I have seen

[Spark]

"Omonte" OMG Dimer!!!!!! That's the funniest thing I have seen

What happened to that post??? I can not find it