Touts vs Handicappers

[Buzz]

Hi Guys,

A few things to keep in mind. Anyone can charge any amount they want and claim any record they want. What is to stop them? I am always suprised to see what people post in these service sections and often wonder if they get clients from it. I assume they must since they continue to do it. I have no idea if guys on this board are honest or not and I have always had a policy not to judge other services. If you are looking for a service there are certainly things you can do if you take the time to do a little research.

A few things to avoid when looking for a service

Here is the bottom line.

Don't pay for a service that cannot document every play each day.

Don't pay for a service that claims outrageous winning percentages unless they can prove it with an independent monitor

Don't pay for a service that uses outrageous marketing ploys

When searching for a sports handicapping service it is very important to distinguish between true Handicappers and Touts/Marketers.

Records: Touts: Publishes selective records, promotes current successes and hides defeats. Go to the services monitors and breakdown their record by sport, units per play etc as well as looking at the overall long term record. Check to see if the service is on a good run or struggling. You can get a wealth of information from a good monitor

Goals: Touts Create a need for today's games via a marketing campaign and everyday special play games.

Fees: Touts charge high to very high fees. Anywhere from $350.00 to $2500 per month

Money Management: Does the service you are looking at have a solid money management system? Do they constantly load up each day on a special play game? You need to understand that a disciplined approach is needed to achieve any long term success. Remember, poor money management is the number one reason sports gamblers fail.

Buzz
http://www.buzzsportspicksservice.com

[Ryan C]

Just becuase you sell picks does not make you a crook Somepeople like the Unionman is just some kid who probably really thinks he has something to offer but it's so comical it's a Joke he's not some big time Con but he sures as hell won't help you either his service is Just comical LOL looks like a Kid did his website

others like Buzz are ok But still i would never pay for picks but Buzz won't hurt you....and at least he has some skill

Then you have the BIGTIME CROOKS like Jack price, Ty gaston, Stu Feiner, Sam Weiss these guys are Con men they make a living by stealing money

Then you have the marketers like Feist and all of his stooges and guys like The Animal and OC Dooley LOL etc

Im telling you guys....DON"T PAY FOR PICKS but if you want to learn the lesson the hard way be my guest they say hard earned education is the best anyway

[Buzz]

Ryan,

I have no problem with anyone who would never pay for picks. There are lots of good cappers on the boards. If you have the time and experience it takes that is awesome. Every sports gambler I know has a little bit different approach and style. There are a ton of resources out there for anyone that wants to take the time to utilize them. You would be suprised how many people don't have the time or dont want to take the time. They just want to ride a hot capper for 10 or 20 bucks for a day. They may not be a day to day player but when they play sometimes a service gives them a little more confidence to get on a game they may normally not be on, or get out of a bad play because they may not have the experience to see a trap. We see guys who are just going out to the sports bar with the fellas on Saturday and will pay a small fee for the day's plays. There are many reasons why someone may use a service long term or for short term recreation. I would just hope anyone looking for one not become a sucker and at least have a clue what to look for and where to find it. That is really my only point.

Buzz

Can the Cubs just close this game out!!!

[meteor]

first of all,cubs win

second of all,i do think the cappers that post their records on their site,although maybe not optimal,is at least better than nothing at all.you do have to think that if they are trying to get clients and retain clients,it would be hard to do that if they were lying about their record on their site in front of their own members.

this is especially true if they charge reasonable monthly fees...that way you can try the service out for a month,without paying a ton of cash and see for yourself.or ask for a trial period.where it is hard is where someone is asking you to shell out a ton of cash beforehand and ask you to take their word at face value.i've seen too many out and out lies to do that for anyone in this business.

[savage1]

For what its worth, although I have not personally used Buzz yet, I like the way in which he presents himself without the bs and hype of others and admire his candid honesty; the criterion he uses for those who may want to use a sports service is in my mind just what the doctor ordered;some services should take a lesson.
Although I did not study marketing in college, I did study psychology, and at least from my point of view, the way in which one presents himself/herself in trying to sell any product is as important as the product itself.
Most folks don't like loudmouths who come across in an arrogant manner and make wildly exaggerated claims about whatever it is they are selling.
I totally disagree with the philosophy of one well known service (not referring to Mr. Gaston here) which in defending its deceptive advertising and telling half-truths and spinning their record, has told me that potential clients "buy the sizzle and not the steak." and obviously are of the Machiavellian philosophy that the end justifies the means.
Hint-go to www.godspicks.com

[Buzz]

I agree having records on your site may not always be the best thing. I have questioned it myself from time to time. For me I am just more comfortable with full disclosure. If we lose a client because of it, so be it. At least the ones that do come to us know exaclty how we have been doing. If you were to look at our NCAA FB record we are only 28-31 after a poor start but are 16-6 the last two Saturday's. Monday night we hit the side and total but were 1-6 sunday with a bad day to say the least day. The best way to judge a service is over the long term. How can anyone judge you over the long term if clients/potential clients dont have access to your records? This has been the deciding factor why we keep them up. It just feels like a better approach. I noticed others are starting to do the same and many will not touch this. I see someone pounding another service here tonight for an 0-4 night. Wow, one bad night is not the end of the world. I went and looked at that services documented record and they have done very well. Even the best are not going to win everyday and paying for a selection is not a guarantee to win. It should be a guarantee that a service put the work into handicapping the game however.

Buzz

[Baseball_Nut]

well said Buzz

[Baseball_Nut]

if a service is not monitored the stay away

[fathed99]

why did you mention Animal? i've been following his football plays for the past couple weeks and he has been total nails. Profiting damn near every day, with a 6-0 college sweep last saturday. Sure anyone can sweep a day here & there but I have yet to be proven wrong by this guy. Is he a tout like the others?

OC Dooley seems like he knows his stuff but his 4-5* plays have really been takin it from behind the last couple plays.

Any advice would help???

[savage1]

Let me give you my take as I have used these guys from time to time as well as chatted with them on line about a number of things:
First of all both are extremely knowledgeable, classy and it is a joy to converse with them and get their take on things.
Animal's speciality is football although last I looked at www.trackpicks.com he is good in all sports.
Animal like anyone else is streaky and when he his hot, go with him;he is a momentum player and will really bang teams when they/he are/is winning.
OC Dooley, another class act, has run into a little trouble of late but is quite good over time in my opinion in big plays, and if you like totals, there is no one better and rates for latter are incredibly cheap, usually $8 on line for all totals going that day.
Both were involved with Stu Feiner for a long time, and both are doing their best to free themselves from that stigma if you get my drift.
Hope above helps.
ps Both are EXTREMELY honest and don't give you any bs;they tell you when they win and when they lose, and don't exaggerate or spin their record.

[Ryan C]

OC DOOLEY is Chris Jordan for one thing

Animal and Dooley both make money from Freescoreboard.com

they work under the same roof

Dooley had is Monday night game of the year on the Bears +4

The Animal had a 4 STAR on the Packers -4

yet the money all went to freecoreboard.com it all went to the same office. think about that....THE MONEY WENT TO THE SAME OFFICE

yet some people got the bears and others got the Packers if thats not a scam please tell me what is

Animal, Dooley, Godsey, The Duke, Ashton, Stroud,

they all WORK together under ONE roof the money all goes to the same place..FREESCOREBOARD.com then they divide it all up. Call 1-877-373-3866 and listen to these frauds hype games and LIE

The Animal takes the Packers , Dooley takes the Bears, Jack Stroud takes the Over, Jimmy Ashton takes the Under LOL it's all a scam they just play a game of odds with you and let the money flow into Freescoreboard.com

lets get real guys these men once worked for Stu feiner they sat back and watched Stu feiner take thousands from his suckers and did nothing about it. They pretend to be nice guys on line....YEAH RIGHT they won't even tell you there real names

OC Dooley also says on his web site he use to be the Ghost writter for Chris Jordan....I read somewhere else he use to go by the name Chris Jordan...but whatever the truth is OC Dooley is connected to Chris Jordan Big time.......and Chris Jordan works for Stu feiner go to biggreenmachine.net that site is owned by Stu feiner call Feiners scorephone 1-800-222-5818 if you don't think so....on the site they advertise Chris Jordan

Mike Godsey has been caught making his record look better then what it really is.....well guess what he owns freescoreboard.com he works with the Animal and OC Dooley it's all a team of hucksters



These guys just want to sell packages BOTTOM LINE

imagine sitting in your living room with your buddy watching the monday night game you have the Bears your buddy has the packers and people paid both of you for the winner. your sitting there laughing drinking beer you can't lose your just looking at all the money that came into the house and counting it and you know more will come in becuase some will win and will be buying tuesdays plays. LOL trust me these guys are slick marketers...and don't fall for those fancy write-ups they do either OC DOOLEY had a 10 page write-up how the bears could not lose The Animal did a write-up how the packers Can't lose. trust me anybody could go to *******.com get a bunch of crazy stats in two seconds and do some write-up.

Bottom line they just take turns it;s a game of odds if the OC DOOLEY goes 0-5 Big Deal the Animal will go 3-1 and OC has no problems becuase the Animal will cover for him

if OC DOOLEY and the Animal both have a 1-4 day well guess what Mike Godsey went 4-0 etc etc

Bottom line as long as some one is winning the money will flow into FREESCAMBOARD.com

when you didvide it all up they proabaly make around $350 a day

making a extra $127,750.00 / year is a nice chunk of change for not really doing anything

if you think these guys are here to help you......THINK AGAIN

these guys are not Doctors....they are pro marketers and CROOKS

[Ryan C]

Animals scorephone # is 1-866-373-3866

LOL if these guys are not touts who the hell is

SUPERLOCKLINE my ass

[savage1]

Ryan-You certainly make some valid and well thought out points.
The only place where I might disagree with you is that some of scamdicappers who "live under one roof" deliberately give out different sides of the same game to make sure someone wins in the group whereas some don't .
Although I can't prove it, I don't believe that Animal and OC Dooley operate in the manner in which you described and think that they at least operate and make picks independently.
I have my doubts about the Cokins, Feists, etc. under the same roof especially since they have resorted to calling me andmany othera at home hwich leads me to believe they will resort to anything to get you to buy their picks.

[Intraware1]

some good points in this thread.....believe me ive followed animal (mark) for a while now....and from what he's displayed on other forums...he's acted like a class act....maybe its just an act....i dont know for certain but he's posted MANY more winners than losers, many of his 4and5* plays for free....ditto for OCD...

i recently asked animal the same question about the scoreboard and he claimed it was to cut down on expenses. He said to post the adds in USA today etc cost big time money. I will agree they all tout their plays on the scoreboard....i guess those who actually believe animal and ocd are walking the str8 and narrow will never know for certain b/c we dont see how they split up the money...by animal claims he doesnt know OCD's plays unless OCD tells him and he gets nothing from him....and vice versa....he did say its a little tough when 1 guy has a GOY on 1 side and he has a 4* on the other....but he claims its all separate.....


like i said i will never know for certain if he's telling the truth or not...but my personal opinion is he's telling the truth....im sure it doesnt help his credibilty any when your always gonna have the Stu Feiner stigma attached to your name....he said he given up on trying to change peoples minds on that a long time ago...."people are gonna believe what they want to believe"

HuskerFan

[savage1]

Intraware and Ryan,
Having had a fair number of talks on line as well as listening to these guys and buying some of their picks over the years I have followed them, I personally would be very much surprised if there was any collusion between The Animal and OC.
For my money each has his own unique system of capping, and you well know, that can easily translate into having a different opinion the same game.
As stated ,both are extremely intelligent, knowledgeble honest, classy are are presently trying to rid themselves of the Stu Feiner stigma as was mentioned already.