my 2 cents

[Tony Vegas]

in my opinion i think it is wrong that everyone keeps insiting to put an asterik or strip bonds of his accomplishments. did he use steriods? probably. but there is no proof. despite manys disgust with bonds using steriods, in reality he didn't break any MLB rules. they just recently starting testing for steriods and anyone that failed those tests is just a moron b/c they had months of warning. bonds might have been on juice but that doesn't mean he should be stripped. if he is then Caminit should be stripped of his MVP, Canseco of all his homeruns, etc. until their is proof of bonds using steriods, i think everyone should cut him a break. personally i am tired of hearing all this talk about steriods. to say espn doesn't have the balls is just wrong. they talk about steriods every show they have. i wish mlb would either get serious about it or everyone should just drop it.

[BettorsChat]

One problem with that is back in the old days steroids didn't even exist so they had no choice of taking them or not. Not only that, but the baseball wasn't wound as tight and the pitching wasn't as thin.

[ezpickin]

Plenty of proof...just look at his head size!!! Look at his body changes relatively late in his life...NO DOUBT he has been a juice user...Do you really believe he didnt use steroids??? Come on Tony...you can argue he shouldnt be stripped of anything because it wasnt "illegal" and go down that path...but to say he shouldnt be stripped because no one has proved it is being more than a little naive...and thats my 2 cents btw :-)...on another note, the Blazers BLOW!!!

[frankb03]

Tony

Tony do you truly feel that Bonds never took steroids?

I hear what you are saying. You make some valid points. Yes, he didn't break any rules BUT....... in my book his records are tainted. I think many feel the same way. I will tell you this IMO Bonds doesn't make my top-10 all time greats. Not even close! I'm not sure if he makes my top-20. Probably not!

[Tony Vegas]

i think he DID take steroids. you guys are excatly right but what was done was done. stripping people after the fact, i think is wrong. he didn't break rules. it would be like stripping the yankees of championships b/c they spend twice as much as everyone. he is still a great player and to not rate him in top five let alone top 20 is crazy.

BC, to say all those things didn't exist is a valid point but you also have to add that all the great black players weren't even in the league, the players weren't as big (steriods or no steriods) and the pressure today is way higher today.

[Cocaine Cowboy]

i agree with you tony. you can't look at any sport in this day and time, where a player hasnt benefited from science. back then the fences were alot closer as well. theres all kinds of factors, that play in to this. i would say mark mcguire is the beneficary out of this whole deal. he got out before the questions begun, and all that is remembered is his homeruns.

[djlivejive]

i thought fences back then were farther for sure, these new stadiums that are bein built seem to be smaller and try to get fans closer to field....i think bonds used roids w/o question but i feel overall competition from the past cannot even be compared to todays athletes/pitchers and plus bonds is gettin walked with 2 outs and no one on base back then they werent intetionally walkin hitters like todays game.

[BettorsChat]

I disagree tony about the fences being shorter back then as the Polo Grounds was huge. And about the media being worse with pressure. Back then when Roger Maris was going for the single season record he had to give interviews before every game that lasted hours on hours. Nowadays these guys may give a few minutes before the game with the rest coming after the game. Hank AaRon received all kinds of death threats etc. I'm also not sure how far you're going back as i'm talking about the 50's, 60's etc. as there was plenty of black ball players in during those times.

[frankb03]

Also today's athletes are pampered. They have no pressure. They earn millions. Talk about pressure! There's probably no athlete that faces more pressure and Jackie Robinson.

Mays played in a stadium where the wind was mostly blowing in. The pitching was far better. Today's pitchers are terrible.

[TDS]

I don't think Bonds took steriods at all.

From his growth of size and the size of his head, that is a sign of growth hormones. A more powerful and faster gain than steriods.

No human body can go from 180 to 235 of solid muscle in that short of span without HGH.

[thesandman]

His records are tainted

Since most of you seem to agree that Bonds did use steroids, the real question is how good would Bonds be without steroids. I believe he started taking steroids when he came to the Giants and that he was aware of BALCO right away because his dad or someone took him there. If that is really the case, Bonds time in Pittsburg is more representative of how good he really is.

During his 7 years in Pittsburg, with over 500 at bats in 5 of those seasons and over 400 the other two, Bonds never hit MORE than 34 HR's in any season. During his 11 seasons in San Francisco, Bonds never hit LESS than 33 HR's in any season. Also, Candlestick was more of a pitchers park than Three Rivers. In 8 of his 11 years as a Giant, his slugging % was higher than his highest % in Pittsburg. Based just on his stats in Pittsburg, even the Hall of Fame would be questionable.

If anyone is drawing a different conclusion than I am, then just wait until the end of this "no steriods" season and compare it to last season on steriods. There should be a big dropoff, more than the normal dropoff for being a year older. If what he does this season is similar, or worse, than his stats while a Pirate, that's just more reason to feel there should be an * next to his records. Or even **********. That's my 10 asterick conclusion.