Don't look in the Mirror

[wayne1218]

Tony, I know Varitek is dreadful at the plate this year but i just can't agree with you. When he went out last year with an injury, this team went in the tank the next day and their season blew up.

I don't care if he doesn't hit a lick at the plate. He is the heart & Soul of this team and club house and that C is on his chest is there for a reason.

[TwoTonTony]

My point is this and i want you to answer it for me.. When was the last time the team with the best record in BASEBALL won the world series?? Come on buddy.. Im waiting.. Records does not mean shit when it comes to playoff time.. We are all 0-0 when it starts..

When was it?

[Three Jack]

My point is this and i want you to answer it for me.. When was the last time the team with the best record in BASEBALL won the world series?? Come on buddy.. Im waiting.. Records does not mean shit when it comes to playoff time.. We are all 0-0 when it starts..

T, first of all I have said all along the Yankees will make the playoffs. Secondly, you are right and no one is disputing the fact that you can win a WS with only 83 wins. I was responding to your one sentence in your post that read, AND I QUOTE, "What are ya gonna say IF the team with the "best record" in baseball chokes away a 14 game lead and does not win the division??"

And to answer that question, is that there is no sense answering IF, IF, IF, IF, IF...we will wait for it to happen...because it isn't!

[TwoTonTony]

Tony, I know Varitek is dreadful at the plate this year but i just can't agree with you. When he went out last year with an injury, this team went in the tank the next day and their season blew up.

I don't care if he doesn't hit a lick at the plate. He is the heart & Soul of this team and club house and that C is on his chest for a reason.

Wayne, last year you are correct, but the injuries piled up one after the other after he went down. I DO care if he hits a lick........

He should be hitting .275 and if not should be dropped to #8 or #9.......I have seen him end more innings striking out this year than ever before or hit into dp's......I realize what a catcher means to a ball club (i caught for 15 years).....He is the glue for the staff....

[molta02]

yanks go farther in the playoffs than the red sox. bank it.

[TMAC951]

T, first of all I have said all along the Yankees will make the playoffs. Secondly, you are right and no one is disputing the fact that you can win a WS with only 83 wins. I was responding to your one sentence in your post that read, AND I QUOTE, "What are ya gonna say IF the team with the "best record" in baseball chokes away a 14 game lead and does not win the division??"

And to answer that question, is that there is no sense answering IF, IF, IF, IF, IF...we will wait for it to happen...because it isn't!

Ok keep saying that.. I just want you to be around if it does happen.. Honestly i could care less if we win the division or not as long as the yanks make the playoffs thats what its all about.. I would love to see boston choke away a 14 game lead but if it doesnt happen and the yanks still make the playoffs I will be just as happy by winning the WC and getting into the playoffs ..

[wayne1218]

Wayne, last year you are correct, but the injuries piled up one after the other after he went down. I DO care if he hits a lick........

He should be hitting .275 and if not should be dropped to #8 or #9.......I have seen him end more innings striking out this year than ever before or hit into dp's......I realize what a catcher means to a ball club (i caught for 15 years).....He is the glue for the staff....

Who would you rather have that is better Tony? Mirabelli?? Cash???

There are very few catchers in baseball that can hit and there are even less that can consider themselves the leader and Captain on the team. I don't know who or what you would rather have but i don't see anything out there that would add more than Varitek to this team on and off the field. I bet Beckett, Schilling, Papelbon and many other pitchers would tell you you're crazy too because they love him and feel comfort with him behind the plate calling the game ... and that means more to me than his 3-4 AB's each game.

[TwoTonTony]

Who would you rather have that is better Tony? Mirabelli?? Cash???

There are very few catchers in baseball that can hit and there are even less that can consider themselves the leader and Captain on the team. I don't know who or what you would rather have but i don't see anything out there that would add more than Varitek to this team on and off the field. I bet Beckett, Schilling, Papelbon and many other pitchers would tell you you're crazy too because they love him and feel comfort with him behind the plate calling the game ... and that means more to me than his 3-4 AB's each game.

wayne.....you obviously did not read what i wrote......I said i agreed that the catcher is the glue that hols the team together and he is that glue........Mirabelli stinks and Cash is the worst hitter of the bunch but both can catch Wakefield.....

What i am saying if you read it is that I am tired of him ending innings with double plays and K's......If he is not hitting drop him to the #8 or #9 spot.....Never said they had better alternatives......but it is frustrating to watch it play out the same night after night.......


also i believe off-the field leadership is a term contsrued by people who played amateur sports but does not apply to major league or any professional sports.....Many of these guys do not even see each other outside of the lines....They are simply 25 individual contractors who are hired by the same team.....and some get along and some don't......I buy the on the field argument, but off the field...no

[wayne1218]

wayne.....you obviously did not read what i wrote......I said i agreed that the catcher is the glue that hols the team together and he is that glue........Mirabelli stinks and Cash is the worst hitter of the bunch but both can catch Wakefield.....

What i am saying if you read it is that I am tired of him ending innings with double plays and K's......If he is not hitting drop him to the #8 or #9 spot.....Never said they had better alternatives......but it is frustrating to watch it play out the same night after night.......

To me the Wakefield thing is so over blown it isn't even funny. Alot of catchers would struggle catching a knuckleball pitcher but most never have to try. No catcher plays 7 days a week so to me him not catching Wakefield every 5 days means absolutely nothing. Yes, he sucks at the plate. He has had a couple of big hits to help win games this month too though. It is shocking when it happens but it has.

As far as the lineup goes, Francona has fucked that up all year. He has ZERO consistancy with it and it changes every day. We could talk about several people and where they should be hitting. I blame Francona for that though, not Varitek.

[Three Jack]

Ok keep saying that.. I just want you to be around if it does happen

Rest assured that I wll make sure i lose internet access for about 7 months if it does!!!

[wayne1218]

also i believe off-the field leadership is a term contsrued by people who played amateur sports but does not apply to major league or any professional sports.....Many of these guys do not even see each other outside of the lines....They are simply 25 individual contractors who are hired by the same team.....and some get along and some don't......I buy the on the field argument, but off the field...no

Well we agree to disagree. Newspapers, interviews and everything i see on pre and post game stuff on NESN has players, management, analysts and announcers talking constantly about Varitek and what he does to help his teammates off the field. Last night ESPN announcers were talking about how Varitek had called several players who played with JD Drew on other teams and he asked them all to help figure out what JD needed to do to turn things around offensively. They said to a man that other players respected Varitek enough to take the call and try to help Jason out. Varitek took the info and has been Drew's biggest supporter in trying to help him through his struggles. How many players would go through that for a teammate? You hear this stuff with Varitek constantly and that totally disproves your point. I think it does matter and i think it does exist!

[TwoTonTony]

To me the Wakefield thing is so over blown it isn't even funny. Alot of catchers would struggle catching a knuckleball pitcher but most never have to try. No catcher plays 7 days a week so to me him not catching Wakefield every 5 days means absolutely nothing. Yes, he sucks at the plate. He has had a couple of big hits to help win games this month too though. It is shocking when it happens but it has.

As far as the lineup goes, Francona has fucked that up all year. He has ZERO consistancy with it and it changes every day. We could talk about several people and where they should be hitting. I blame Francona for that though, not Varitek.

BINGO....see my first rant....it is about Francona....

I caught a very good knuckleballer and it is no joke....you literally get beat up.....some guys can do it and some can....takes a real feel....can not explain it any other way....
No catcher can or should catch that many days in a row nor a day game after a night game.....It takes its toll on your body...Notice over the years catchers power numbers drop from late august to the end of the season because the power base (legs) are worn down......It is tough to keep weight on during the season as a catcher.....No easy feat

Baseball is a beautiful game and it is about the law of averages over time.....a .300 hitter is a ,300 hitter and when given a chance to hit out of his slump will become what his baseball card says....

I am ranting today as a bothered fan looking for something to blame......

JD Drew - i just do not like and think we were nuts to think he was an AL East type player.....let alone Boston or NY

[Three Jack]

Jack, I disagree. A tough beat such as last nights beat often leads to additional beats. I disagree...I would like to beliee that this team is mentally tough. I would agree if you were dealing with a mediocre or bad baseball team. The good one's can bounce back better.
IF the Sox blow the division IMO they'll have some doubt heading into the playoffs. Especially after blowing a 14 game lead. They are showing many kinks in their armor. I agree in that they would have some doubt and that they have shown some weaknesess. Name a team that doesn't show a weakness!
Who's to say the Yanks will face the Angels? Currently, the Angels and Indians have the same record. Only 2 1/2 behind the Sox. It was my opinion...and I could careless who the Sox play as they have had success against both. Can't say that for the NYY against LAA...if I were a Yankee fan, that is the one team I woul dnot want to face.
Since the all star break the Yanks have the best record. They've closed the gap by 11 games. Yes they have, they have played great baseball for 2 months.
Like you, I'm a Met fan. I dislike the Yanks. I'm not sitting here rooting for the Yanks.

See above

[TwoTonTony]

Well we agree to disagree. Newspapers, interviews and everything i see on pre and post game stuff on NESN has players, management, analysts and announcers talking constantly about Varitek and what he does to help his teammates off the field. Last night ESPN announcers were talking about how Varitek had called several players who played with JD Drew on other teams and he asked them all to help figure out what JD needed to do to turn things around offensively. They said to a man that other players respected Varitek enough to take the call and try to help Jason out. Varitek took the info and has been Drew's biggest supporter in trying to help him through his struggles. How many players would go through that for a teammate? You hear this stuff with Varitek constantly and that totally disproves your point. I think it does matter and i think it does exist!

He is the exception to the rule and probably why he wears the C.......but the media loves these feel good stories...I also think that IS his responsibility to find out about Drew.....as the Captain.....I mean that most guys go their own way after they are done playing.....Not like the 50's-70's....

You are not disproving my point.......You nor I do not know what goes on in the locker room and at their homes. It appears that Varitek is the exception, because I knew some ex-players in baseball and NFL and they say it is nothing like a team in college or high school.....There are guys that just do not like each other and HAVE to get along......Also the notion of pep talks amongst many pros is comical as well. They are expected to be motivated and a speech is not going to turn that around.

We both agree Varitek is a good captain and is respected. He is trying to help Drew out.....It does not look like it has helped but he has tried.....I am just saying in pro sports that off the field leadership is more of a myth than fact anymore....These guys leave and they want nothing to do with it until they get back the next day

[wayne1218]

I don't know Tony. I think in most cases you are right, but clearly not in all as you seem to feel. Many things on this team like players and more importantly their wives are some of the biggest supporters of the JD Drew family and what they have gone through with their infant. Many, many hours have been spent at the hospital by players and wives and JD Drew said that, so i feel like i do know (Unless he is lying). Most athletes are selfish, i agree. This team though has many, many off field incidents of solidarity off the field though and they have ever since '04.

There are reasons why guys like Damon, Millar and Mirabelli miss Boston so much after their gone and i believe it goes beyond the field of play with this team. I can't speak of other teams because i don't see them daily.