one of my buddies just told me the Health Care has passed

[grandmama]

by the way, Stupid is a pre-existing condition.

[Big Country 5]

You will be effected if you already have insurance.Your premiums are going up and your taxes are going up to insure all the illegals and people to sorry get out and work.Its just a effort to redistribute wealth via healthcare.

[grandmama]

You will be effected if you already have insurance.Your premiums are going up and your taxes are going up to insure all the illegals and people to sorry get out and work.Its just a effort to redistribute wealth via healthcare.

why do you believe this? Whatever you have read makes you believe that its just the poor or illegals that will benifit. It is all a huge lie. Mostly, the people that suffer are people that already have insurance. Listen to people around you that have gone through all of this. Again, my best friend growing up is a very successful lawyer, I'm talking millions. Last year he had someone in his family that was in the hospital for over two months, and BCBS dropped their coverage. She was still sick, and essentially, BCBS was tired of paying the bill. She ended up recovering, but after another 40 days in the hospital. They had to fork out over 500 K for her stay. She would not be here today, if she came from a middle class family. The fact that my friend was a millionare was and is the only reason she is alive. Wake up people. If you have insurance, it is not going to be enough if you or one in your family gets sick for a long period of time.

[garth]

where is it written in a free market society that everyone is entitled to healthcare, own a house, have a good job, etc. there are always going to be haves and have-nots, that's free markets and what has made this a great country. there are many people that started with nothing and become well off. that's why people are always trying to come here, i don't see a line of people wanting to leave.

i have the same problem with welfare, it tends to make people stay in the handout way of life. it's amazing what people can do when they have no choice. god forbid they have to work two jobs, or cut back on things they don't really need.

you mention food. if that's REALLY the case, why is there so many obese people that are poor? you don't see many poor people here that are skin and bones like in 3rd world countries that REALLY do have to go without food.

I wouldn't even know where to start to respond to this one. If the basic premise is that you have to be wealthy to afford healthcare, then I guess we just continue to implicitly ration healthcare based on ability to pay rather than planniing based on any reasonable priorities to control cost. Then when healthcare costs get to about 40% of the GDP even the middle class won't be able to afford it. Many of them are already there actually.

[grandmama]

where is it written in a free market society that everyone is entitled to healthcare, own a house, have a good job, etc. there are always going to be haves and have-nots, that's free markets and what has made this a great country. there are many people that started with nothing and become well off. that's why people are always trying to come here, i don't see a line of people wanting to leave.

i have the same problem with welfare, it tends to make people stay in the handout way of life. it's amazing what people can do when they have no choice. god forbid they have to work two jobs, or cut back on things they don't really need.

you mention food. if that's REALLY the case, why is there so many obese people that are poor? you don't see many poor people here that are skin and bones like in 3rd world countries that REALLY do have to go without food.

I happen to believe in democracy over the free-market or capitalism.Our country was founded on democratic values, not free-market values. I often see the Adam Smith quote referring to the 'invisible-hand' misquoted often. If one would actually read his book, his argument is not for capitalism, but against the Oligarchies that was around in Europe at that time. I'd have to say that his quote has been taken out of context for way too long.

[insidethe8thpol]

Eventually ALL americans will be FORCED onto the PUBLIC OPTION under this BILL and the AVERAGE family of four will see an INCREASE in health insurance premiums to the tune of $5,000.00 per year by the ESTIMATES of the CBO

The CBO also estimates and the DEMS and Nancy Pelosi are counting on this that 14 MILLION people will pay FINES totalling 167 BILLION DOLLARS over the first 10 years and FACE UP TO FIVE YEARS IN JAIL

The DEMS plan will also cover 2.2 MILLION ILLEGALS

The healthcare BILL mandates that the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT if you are pregnant or have small children can come into your home and tell you how to raise your family. If your home state does not allow this so called service they can lose federal funding of say a road project or something

Also under this BILL and mandate home schooling will NOT be allowed, private schools will not be allowed and all children MUST attend only "public schools".

There are also 500 BILLION dollars in cuts to MEDICARE and 85% of seniors will LOSE MEDICARE ADVANTAGE coverage
------------------------------------

[grandmama]

Eventually ALL americans will be FORCED onto the PUBLIC OPTION under this BILL and the AVERAGE family of four will see an INCREASE in health insurance premiums to the tune of $5,000.00 per year by the ESTIMATES of the CBO

The CBO also estimates and the DEMS and Nancy Pelosi are counting on this that 14 MILLION people will pay FINES totalling 167 BILLION DOLLARS over the first 10 years and FACE UP TO FIVE YEARS IN JAIL

The DEMS plan will also cover 2.2 MILLION ILLEGALS

The healthcare BILL mandates that the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT if you are pregnant or have small children can come into your home and tell you how to raise your family. If your home state does not allow this so called service they can lose federal funding of say a road project or something

Also under this BILL and mandate home schooling will NOT be allowed, private schools will not be allowed and all children MUST attend only "public schools".

There are also 500 BILLION dollars in cuts to MEDICARE and 85% of seniors will LOSE MEDICARE ADVANTAGE coverage
------------------------------------

did you copy and paste from the drudge?

[garth]

There are also 500 BILLION dollars in cuts to MEDICARE and 85% of seniors will LOSE MEDICARE ADVANTAGE coverage
------------------------------------

There is no way in hell that AARP would support the legislation if it were detrimental to seniors' health benefits. And they do support it wholeheartedly.

[slappy's son]

Nothing ever passes in the senate. It is where all good bills go to die.. Don't see a problem with another option for those that cannot get affordable coverage. My friend, that is a Doctor son is not going to be able to be covered on his insurace anymore, and he has not found anyone that will cover him because he has had heart problems in the past. I just do not understand how anyone that claims to be a christian or religious can sleep at night knowing that their are millions of americans out there dying because they cannot afford coverage. I don't think Christ would be against health care, especially since it now will not cover abortions.

You ARE joking, right??? Anyone who believe's O'Sama's bullshit about MILLIONS not covered in an idiot! most of those not coverged are by their OWN doing, with mopst being young persons just not chhosing to purchase healthcare! You want socialized medicine, where the government will decide whether you live or die, go to another couintry! Just becuase they are covering you DOESN'T mean you'll get that heart surgery, or the colon cancer operation!! FACT!! If you're 65, and need a life-saving operation...... chances are = YOU WILL NOT GET IT!! This socialized medicine bill is planned to save money, period. And if you're over 60, the allowable funds and coverages you will be permitted to have drop dramatically. This is a scary time in this country's history! socialized medicine DOES NOT WORK! There's not a country on this planet that has good government run health care.

For those bitching about not being covered, try giving up smoking, drinking, gambling, your cell phone bill and cable bill, and watch how easy it is to purchase a good healthcare plan for you and your family! you'll even have extra money left over!! Just get rid of the things you don't really need, and spent it on the things that matter.

Friggin idiots! As usual, everyone wants the government to take care of them! I pay a LOT for my own healthcare... every penny, and this government-run healthcare is the LAST thing this country needs.

[slappy's son]

The bill is just an option. It will not effect anyone who already has insurance, and likes it.

You're dead wrong here and have NO clue what you're saying! you will NOT have the option of purchasing your own healthcare plan, and WILL be forced to join and pay for the government-run plan. That's how they pay for this! This will not work if everyone is not involved. Know what you're saying before you post and preach to others!

Most doctors want this bill passed.

Dead wrong again!! The vast majority of doctors DO NOT want this bill to pass!! Many doctors say they will close up shop if force to participate in a government-run system. Again, know what your saying and post only the facts.

Botton line is this, people should not have to choose between their light bill and health care.

This statement is a joke! they are NOT choosing between these things, but between healthcare and cigarettes, beer, lottery tickets, cell phones and cable bill! Try giving these up and see how much money there is on a monthly basis to use on healthcare! It's EZ!! you sound exactly like OSama when you make BS statements like this. Of the 40 million who are not coverege by insurance, 25-30 million CHOOSE not to be covered!

Socialized medicine run by the government is that absolute worst thing that can happen to this country!! Get rid of the illegal aliens and pass tort reform and you'll solve the entire problem!!

[garth]

Dead wrong again!! The vast majority of doctors DO NOT want this bill to pass!! Many doctors say they will close up shop if force to participate in a government-run system. Again, know what your saying and post only the facts.



!!

I guess the American Medical Association should have sought your wise counsel prior to endorsing the legislation. Serious oversight on their part.

[garth]

Get rid of the illegal aliens and pass tort reform and you'll solve the entire problem!!

Evidence-based estimates of the cost of medical malpractice liability range from 1.5 - 2% of the cost of healthcare. Yeah, tort reform is a panacea...it's all we need. That should do it.

[husker]

I wouldn't even know where to start to respond to this one. If the basic premise is that you have to be wealthy to afford healthcare, then I guess we just continue to implicitly ration healthcare based on ability to pay rather than planniing based on any reasonable priorities to control cost. Then when healthcare costs get to about 40% of the GDP even the middle class won't be able to afford it. Many of them are already there actually.

where did i say you had to be wealthy?

i can see why you couldn't respond to my post, talking points don't help directly answering a question.

maybe i can make it easier for you.

1) where is it written in a free market society that everyone is entitled to healthcare, own a house, have a good job, etc.

2) you mention food. if that's REALLY the case, why is there so many obese people that are poor? you don't see many poor people here that are skin and bones like in 3rd world countries that REALLY do have to go without food.

[insidethe8thpol]

I guess the American Medical Association should have sought your wise counsel prior to endorsing the legislation. Serious oversight on their part.

By Robert Laszewski

The AMA came out in support of the House Democratic health care bill this afternoon—sort of. From their press release:

“The American Medical Association (AMA) today announced support for concurrent passage of H.R. 3962 and H.R. 3961, U.S. House of Representatives health system reform bills."

I would suggest the operative word is "concurrent."

HR 3962 is the big House health care bill. HR 3961 is the standalone bill that would spend $210 billion (latest CBO score for the bill) to cancel the Sustainable Growth Rate Formula cuts and pays for it by adding the full cost to the deficit. That proposal failed in the Senate a few weeks ago when only 47 Democrats supported it.

In short, the AMA is saying we’ll support the House bill but it is going to cost $210 billion in additional federal debt to get our vote.

At least they know exactly what they want!

What will be really interesting is to see where the AMA stands on the Democratic health care bills when they finally figure out there isn't another $210 billion in the bag for them.

What's worse? That the AMA would so blatantly put a $210 billion price tag on their support or that they are gullible enough to be played by a Democratic leadership that only had 47 votes on the Senate floor two weeks ago for the very same thing?

[garth]

where did i say you had to be wealthy?

i can see why you couldn't respond to my post, talking points don't help directly answering a question.

maybe i can make it easier for you.

1) where is it written in a free market society that everyone is entitled to healthcare, own a house, have a good job, etc.

2) you mention food. if that's REALLY the case, why is there so many obese people that are poor? you don't see many poor people here that are skin and bones like in 3rd world countries that REALLY do have to go without food.

Where did I say that owning a house and having a good job were entitlements? As to your question about where it is written that basic healthcare is a right, it's not written. That's a basic philosophical point upon which Americans obviously disagree.